I agree with this, a letter explaining their negligence might get them to give you a refund.
I've been framed
- Thread starter Uncommon
- Start date
Go back to the dealer.... period. A dealers license is probably his livelihood and if it was cheap like you said a smart one would buy it back. If he doesn't buy it back park it down the road or across the street with a sign on it with the dealers name, photos and explanation....
That said pictures are not the whole story, getting it on a lift and poking around is key, a ball peen hammer can tell you a lot, including if you have weak spots or not. The LJ I have started because my uncle had a mechanic tell him he had a real "bad" section behind the passenger front tire, when I heard about this and knowing the shady shop also sells cars often acquired from customers I had him bring it up and I put it on my lift. Now the spot looked pretty bad at first, in fact when you pressed on it it would flex, then I hit it with a grinder w a rust wheel and turns out it was a thin bubble layer, i even drilled a 1/4" hole through it to show him how long it took to drill and it was still thick and was clean under it. I told uncle Mike it was definitely time to scrap, blast and paint or part w it to someone who would to protect it, but definitely don't give it to that shady guy for his lowball offer, he is in his 70s, hence why I now own it.
Anyway do a little inspecting and research if you decide not to force the dealer to take it back, looking at these pictures it looks like it may very well have the potential to have some severe rot as the pictures don't look good, but if it's just a few bad spots they might be fixable.
If dealer isn't willing to buy back,and you don't want to go through a big legal deal, perhaps you can work towards some monetary middle ground compensation, if it were me I would have a 3rd party inspection done then approach the dealer with that, he probably doesn't want it back, but he doesn't want you stopping by every day either possibly running off other customers if you get my drift.... He may just pay you a grand or so to go.
That said pictures are not the whole story, getting it on a lift and poking around is key, a ball peen hammer can tell you a lot, including if you have weak spots or not. The LJ I have started because my uncle had a mechanic tell him he had a real "bad" section behind the passenger front tire, when I heard about this and knowing the shady shop also sells cars often acquired from customers I had him bring it up and I put it on my lift. Now the spot looked pretty bad at first, in fact when you pressed on it it would flex, then I hit it with a grinder w a rust wheel and turns out it was a thin bubble layer, i even drilled a 1/4" hole through it to show him how long it took to drill and it was still thick and was clean under it. I told uncle Mike it was definitely time to scrap, blast and paint or part w it to someone who would to protect it, but definitely don't give it to that shady guy for his lowball offer, he is in his 70s, hence why I now own it.
Anyway do a little inspecting and research if you decide not to force the dealer to take it back, looking at these pictures it looks like it may very well have the potential to have some severe rot as the pictures don't look good, but if it's just a few bad spots they might be fixable.
If dealer isn't willing to buy back,and you don't want to go through a big legal deal, perhaps you can work towards some monetary middle ground compensation, if it were me I would have a 3rd party inspection done then approach the dealer with that, he probably doesn't want it back, but he doesn't want you stopping by every day either possibly running off other customers if you get my drift.... He may just pay you a grand or so to go.
oldb
TJ Enthusiast
I agree with the suggestion to go back to the dealer. I think a consult with a lawyer might not cost to much and give you an idea if there are state agencies that might have a say about selling an unsafe vehicle.
I have often thought it would make me feel much better when I think I have been taken advantage of to post something similar to the famous "you have a bad hotel" complaint from a few years back. If nothing else perhaps reading it will make you feel better.
You Have a Very Bad Hotel - Hyperlinked Organization
hyperorg.com/misc/DoubleTreeShow_files/frame.html
B
I have often thought it would make me feel much better when I think I have been taken advantage of to post something similar to the famous "you have a bad hotel" complaint from a few years back. If nothing else perhaps reading it will make you feel better.
You Have a Very Bad Hotel - Hyperlinked Organization
hyperorg.com/misc/DoubleTreeShow_files/frame.html
B
TheGanzman
TJ Enthusiast
Check on the $ limits for Small Claims Court judgements in KY; back in the day when I was paying attention to these things, it was $2,500 - I bet it's quite a bit more now. Prepare you case summary with photos and a letter or two from a mechanic/shop - you WILL get on the docket. Do your due diligence, make a concise case, then when your court date comes, present the case yourself. Small Claims Court rulings are quick and relatively bulletproof. Even if it doesn't cover ALL of the costs of frame replacement, I would bet that it will cover most; good luck!
As @Chris said I had a shop swap in a new frame for me. I’m only doing it because the Jeep has been in the family since it was new and I’ve had too many memories in the Jeep to get rid of it. That being said I just made an excel sheet today to add up the costs of the frame swap. I’ve concluded that any reasonable person wouldn’t do what I did. The total cost is many many times the current worth of the jeep. I would just part it out. That dealer is pretty crooked to sell you that Jeep under the idea that it is driveable. I wouldn’t drive that thing 10 miles.
I'll send you pictures of my old Silverado if it will make you feel better. You don't know rust until you see a 90s GM driven through 20 Michigan winters. Sorry that they took advantage of you.
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TrailYacht
Member
Go over the whole thing by hand with a chisel or big screwdriver.. start at the back. Front half usually far outlives the back half. Especially on the inside around control arm mounts and coil spring buckets.
I’d poke at the floor a bit as well. (Torque boxes !)
If it’s just a few smaller issues as stated above it may be worth fixing now that you already have it? Good luck!
I’d poke at the floor a bit as well. (Torque boxes !)
If it’s just a few smaller issues as stated above it may be worth fixing now that you already have it? Good luck!
badlieutenant
TJ Addict
I would take it back to the dealer and let it be known that if they do not buy it back immediately that you will begin litigation.
Starrs
TJ Guru
Unfortunately, yes. That is one of the worst areas (and worst external area) of the TJ frame because water (& salt) gets in between the tc skid & the bottom of the rail where they meet & can just sit there, this is why this area is almost always shows the first visible signs of rust/rot. You're not doing yourself any favor by saying out of sight out of mind, if you break a bolt dropping the skid that will tell you there's something wrong in there & if there is we all know it's better to find it & treat it sooner rather than later. I'd drop that puppy today and get a good look-see between there. IF there is rust, grind it down, prep & POR15 it. Then douse your bolts in anti-seize & button it back up. I go one step further, when I fluid film underneath I drop the skid & drench the rails then put it back on.
Easiest way is to put your floor jack under the skid, put a little upward pressure on it & back the bolts out then lower the skid.
I found myself in a similar situation. I bought a crusty Jeep with a plan to do a frame off rebuild. I thought that I had bought a Jeep with a good frame (no holes). However, in the end it was not good. I just bought a like new frame for $1250 on EBay. If you don’t have much invested in the Jeep yet, then an option is to buy a clean used frame and find someone willing to help you with the swap. Your frame looks too far gone for the Safe-T-Caps repairs - I had considered that too, but the repair pieces I needed were going to be $1500 and would be surrounded by thin metal.
Picture of mine below (new frame is on the left)
Picture of mine below (new frame is on the left)
I'm sorry to see that frame on a TJ you just bought from a questionable dealer after getting some questionable advice from a questionable(?) friend.
The first thing I'd do is check if anything within reason can be done to fix it. If it is fixable, the next thing I'd check is how willing that friend is to help do the repairs.
Chances are it's not fixable and I'm not sure what the best way to go would be in that case.
The first thing I'd do is check if anything within reason can be done to fix it. If it is fixable, the next thing I'd check is how willing that friend is to help do the repairs.
Chances are it's not fixable and I'm not sure what the best way to go would be in that case.
Unless you have "mail box money" coming in, or you have a large inheritance in the bank, you need to get out of this deal some how, some way. I think you're over your head with this one. If you can't do the work yourself, this restoration will cost you a fortune having it done by others. This "Jeep" hobby is not for the "weak of wallet".
FieldTrip
Member
update:
Contacted the dealer yesterday and heard from them, ironically enough, a couple of hours ago. They want me to drop it off tomorrow and have their people look at it and will contact me. Good sign that it isn't an immediate "no."
Contacted the dealer yesterday and heard from them, ironically enough, a couple of hours ago. They want me to drop it off tomorrow and have their people look at it and will contact me. Good sign that it isn't an immediate "no."
At least it’s not an immediate no. Still, shame on them for selling what would be considered a dangerous vehicle.
I sincerely hope they do the right thing. I’m rooting for you.
I genuinely believe you have some legal grounds here. This is totally different than someone selling you a vehicle with a bad transmission. This is actually unsafe.
I sincerely hope they do the right thing. I’m rooting for you.
I genuinely believe you have some legal grounds here. This is totally different than someone selling you a vehicle with a bad transmission. This is actually unsafe.
Starrs
TJ Guru
So you went and inspected the jeep? This wasn’t bought site unseen? Correct? How could legal action take place if you willingly bought said jeep and drove it off the lot? Not choosing sides just don’t want to give you false hope in thinking this would actually stand a chance in the court of law. Def sucks that you bought a roached frame, but the price was the price of a tj with a roached frame. Not sure how this could fall back on the dealer. Dealers are shady as hell and if the buyer doesn’t know what to look for that’s not exactly their fault. It’s a used vehicle sold as is.
Starrs
TJ Guru
I don’t think it’s illegal to sell a vechicle like this. @Squatch found a super nice black TJR for dirt cheap a couple months back...why was it dirt cheap...the frame was shot. It’s jot illegal for them to do this. As a buyer you have to do your homework in what your buying. Run the carfax etc...look at the frame. That’s blatantly obvious it’s toast. It’s a shame it wasn’t noticed, but I would think from 10ft away that would have been obvious.
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