Thanks for sharing I didn't know about this, and yes that price (omg lol)
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How to install a Ecoboost oil cooler / heater in a 4.0 and why
- Thread starter Steel City 06
- Start date
Thanks for sharing I didn't know about this, and yes that price (omg lol)
a word on this, looks like Mopar has DC'd it, as they love to do. I don't see a 4792912AF or come up with anything in a search for 4792912A so I don't think it's been superceded.
All that's available now that I can find is SKP and a bunch of no-name Chinesium crap on Amazon. Or, Moparpartsgiant claims to have them if you're willing to pay the $51 hazardous material fee they tack on to pretty much everything now.
In other news it seems like the vehicles using our thread pattern for their oil filters are aging out of support. The motorcraft fl1a I've been using for years is now $12, vs about $3 just a couple of years ago. I think the FL300 is the shorter version and equivalent to the spec'd Mopar and it's only $7.25 so I'll probably go with that one moving forward.
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How does this actually work?
Their website states their PCM's won't support tuners.
Great work...getting great mileage out of a thirsty dog. Maybe next you could experiment with is how to get more hp/torque.
How does this actually work?
Their website states their PCM's won't support tuners.
Great work...getting great mileage out of a thirsty dog. Maybe next you could experiment with is how to get more hp/torque.
It was previously believed that the WF PCM could not take a third-party tune, but that's since been proven to be false.
How does this actually work?
Their website states their PCM's won't support tuners.
Great work...getting great mileage out of a thirsty dog. Maybe next you could experiment with is how to get more hp/torque.
HP Tuners works with the Wranglerfix PCM. You may need a jumper wire to be able to flash it though.
I'm basically doing both in moderation. The vast majority of the mods I'm doing are to reduce parasitic losses and to improve energy extraction from the fuel, both of which increase available power/torque and reduce fuel consumption.
No real data on my power/torque gains unfortunately, but it has been enough of a difference that I no longer have any desire to regear. In fact, if both R&Ps were to pop today, I would still go with 4.10s with the 35s because it is more than I need. 6th gear will hold 95 mph on flat ground, and if I need more than that I can use 5th or 4th.
That is impressive. I am one of those guys who leaves factory settings alone. Otherwise I would ruin stuff. A man has to know his limits, mine are easily attainable.
I bought a Standard Motor Products OCK39 oil cooler. I think it's the same part. Now out of stock everywhere.
But I question the need for the oil "cooler." On most driving my oil never gets much over 170 degrees. When idling I can get the temp up to 185. Tested this all this month with a GlowShift oil and temperature gauge.
Granted where the "temperature" is being read is straight out of the oil pan.
So realistically the only function of that oil plate is going to be heating the oil.
Now...I don't have any skid plates on my oil pan...so perhaps it might help someone with restricted air flow across the pan.
-Mac
But I question the need for the oil "cooler." On most driving my oil never gets much over 170 degrees. When idling I can get the temp up to 185. Tested this all this month with a GlowShift oil and temperature gauge.
Granted where the "temperature" is being read is straight out of the oil pan.
So realistically the only function of that oil plate is going to be heating the oil.
Now...I don't have any skid plates on my oil pan...so perhaps it might help someone with restricted air flow across the pan.
-Mac
Interesting and unexpected. I would have thought circulating through the same block and head as the water jacket, but never passing through a radiator, it would have been ECT at minimum.
What thermostat temp are you using?
@freedom_in_4low take a look here:
-Mac
So I installed a GlowShift 1/8" npt oil pressure sensor and temperature sensor...used two Amazon street T fittings and despite everything no surprise the temperature sensor is leaking oil straight on to my exhaust.
I think I've heard of folks pulling what appears to be that brass plug and drilling it out for additional sensors?
Any advice? I'm loath to unscrew the fitting because it just seems like something I'd completely mess up without a little research.
-Mac
I think I've heard of folks pulling what appears to be that brass plug and drilling it out for additional sensors?
Any advice? I'm loath to unscrew the fitting because it just seems like something I'd completely mess up without a little research.
-Mac
-Mac
@freedom_in_4low take a look here:
So I installed a GlowShift 1/8" npt oil pressure sensor and temperature sensor...used two Amazon street T fittings and despite everything no surprise the temperature sensor is leaking oil straight on to my exhaust.
I think I've heard of folks pulling what appears to be that brass plug and drilling it out for additional sensors?
Any advice? I'm loath to unscrew the fitting because it just seems like something I'd completely mess up without a little research.
-Mac
-Mac
I like it. I've thought about putting some extra sensors in a few places just so I can see what's going on. Some will think it's dumb but my best answer to why is "because I like it".
Ideally, if I could find the time, would be to run them back to a ruggeduino or something similar, and then write an android app to provide an interface.
AC low side and high side pressures
condenser leaving air temp, radiator leaving air temp
radiator outlet coolant temp
heater core outlet coolant temp
HVAC entering and leaving air temp
may as well add oil temp to the list
Yeah crazy idea of gathering data before solving a problem that doesn't need solved.
Couple of questions I have... perhaps the oil does need heated. Especially in the winter. What's really the optimal temperature for modern 10w30 conventional high mileage oils.
I'm monitoring the temperature of the oil out of the pan but we really have no idea how hot the oil is immediately after making through the engine. And I'm not sure there's an easy way to monitor that, nor a necessity to do so...still curious.
It sure would be nice to program the PCM to add more PIDs and do this internally. I'd rather do that then manage a seperate Arduino. That and once it's in the PCM it can be used for tuning and data logging. Heck you could even trigger the check engine light. I'm sure the newer PCMs in the 04-06 range can do it... probably less so with a 97.
-Mac
Couple of questions I have... perhaps the oil does need heated. Especially in the winter. What's really the optimal temperature for modern 10w30 conventional high mileage oils.
I'm monitoring the temperature of the oil out of the pan but we really have no idea how hot the oil is immediately after making through the engine. And I'm not sure there's an easy way to monitor that, nor a necessity to do so...still curious.
It sure would be nice to program the PCM to add more PIDs and do this internally. I'd rather do that then manage a seperate Arduino. That and once it's in the PCM it can be used for tuning and data logging. Heck you could even trigger the check engine light. I'm sure the newer PCMs in the 04-06 range can do it... probably less so with a 97.
-Mac
Mac, would you mind checking the pan temp with an IR thermometer, to see how it compares to your oil temp reading on the gauge?
For conventional oils, especially ones with properties like 10W30 that have widely varying viscosity between cold and hot, heating the oil will make a big difference in how well the oil can flow in the 30 minutes or so after startup.
Bringing the oil up to a consistent operating temperature means that the oil pump has to work far less, since not only is it easier to pump, it flows through all of the orifices easier, meaning less pressure is required to pump it through the engine. The oil will still heat up over time not only because the engine heats it, but also because all of the energy used to pump it becomes heat as well. By dumping waste heat into the oil, you can get rid of a significant portion of that excess pumping loss. It also means less energy is lost in the hydrodynamic bearings, as lower viscosity improves their performance (as long as it doesn't pump itself dry).
That said, all of these things can also be obtained by simply using a 0W30 oil or similar, since the 0W30 has a more consistent viscosity throughout its temperature band.
What the exchanger also does that the 0W30 does not is help prevent buildup of condensation in the oil for shorter trips, such as your typical commute or grocery run. Since it heats the oil almost as fast as the coolant itself warms up, it allows the oil to reject that moisture much sooner, thereby extending the life of the oil, since there is less water left to react with the oil and generate sludge.
0W30 is also still quite expensive, and a few oil changes of that may cost more than just installing the heat exchanger to begin with. 5W30 would still be a gain, but not quite as large as 0W30.
As for its function as a cooler, I don't have data to back this up. I did previously run an air to oil cooler with a 180 degree thermostat, and it was almost always flowing heavily after 20-30 minutes or so. I have however noticed my oil seems way cleaner after 3,000 miles than it used to. Not sure if that's more from the moisture reduction or from limiting the peak temperature of the oil.
The biggest thing I've noticed is less drag on the engine a few minutes after starting driving, more like what you'd expect after driving for 30+ minutes. My guess is that this is due to the lower oil viscosity at the higher temperature allowing for better lubrication of the hydrodynamic bearings, and also taking less energy to pump.
the thing about having data before there's a problem is when a problem does appear and I go to troubleshoot it, I have a baseline to know what's normal. An issue that normally only manifests as a high ECT could easily and quickly narrowed down to the specific component.
Heating it would help it get circulating and doing its job more quickly after an overnight cold soak.
Where you're measuring it is where we would be cooling it, so if it's less than ECT at that point, then it's probably only ever going to be heated, not cooled. If we had a way to intercept it coming back at its hottest temperature, we could cool it there, but there's not really a way to do that.
I agree, but I program HVACR controls all day at work and I know how to program an arduino.... I have no idea how to add PID's to the PCM or whether it can be done.
Since the source code for the PCMs is proprietary, we can really only guess at what is programmable. You can read the hex, but I don't know anyone who can straight up read a hex program and know exactly what does what. What values are figured out are usually kept secret by the tuners; otherwise, anyone would be able to read the hex and change known values.
Megasquirt might be even easier than Arduino. It's an open source ECM that is readily programmable for additional features and modifications. Think of it like a universal 3D printer controller board, just for cars. You can write programs just like an Arduino-based printer board.
Megasquirt might be even easier than Arduino. It's an open source ECM that is readily programmable for additional features and modifications. Think of it like a universal 3D printer controller board, just for cars. You can write programs just like an Arduino-based printer board.
My 05/06 Aeroforce gauge provides many bells and whistles, but it does not track oil temp unless you run it off an independent sensor like Mac has done.
I assume that's because there is no temp sensor to read through a PID. I'd love to be wrong on this...lmk if there is a known sensor, and I will contact AF to see if they can add that tracking capability through the PCM.
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there's not a sensor for it.
Does the AF read fuel level? If I knew how to read the PID for the fuel level sensor I think my Torque app could provide a decent miles to empty calculation. That's the only sensor I can think of that doesn't appear as a standard OBD2 PID. There are of course the calculated items like cam/crank difference, misfire counts, etc that are also not presented as standard PID's but I have less interest in closely following those.
The gauge does for some vehicles, but I don’t believe the TJ provides that info. (Unfortunately I can’t check right now)
Here’s the Chrysler list…not everything applies to the 05/06 Wrangler.
@freedom_in_4low
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