Novak Conversions Jeep Wrangler TJ engine mounts

Jeep sales tanking, buyers say too much tech

You know what? I thought about that until I realized that the one I want is 28k not including taxes and fees.

I can get a TJ for cheaper than that :LOL:

I do like the diesel though.

Mihandra's are only expensive because of government import regulations. If they bought the line they could take over an old Stellanis factory and build/assemble them here.

Their Thar version sells in India for ~$13,500-27,000. The website lets you built the version you want like we are talking about. The larger diesel gets 12.5 km/liter or 29.4 mpg.

https://www.cardekho.com/mahindra/thar

I wonder what US safety and snooping tech requirements add to the cost. I read the government requires remote kill switches in future cars. I guess for safety?
 
Last edited:
  • Wow
Reactions: Chris
Mihandra's are only expensive because of government import regulations. If they bought the line they could take over an old Stellanis factory and build/assemble them here.

Their Thar version sells in India for ~$13,500-27,000. The website lets you built the version you want like we are talking about.

https://www.cardekho.com/mahindra/thar

I wonder what US safety and snooping tech requirements add to the cost. I read the government requires remote kill switches in future cars. I guess for safety?

Wow, it all makes sense now. I knew there was no way that one of those Mahindras should be that expensive.
 
Call me old fashioned, but I wouldn't pull that kind of weight with a half ton truck, much less a Jeep.

When I bought my Jeep in NC, I towed it home on one of the U-Haul car carriers, so around 6k total weight.

I have a 2019 Ranger and it towed it effortlessly (it's rated for 7500).

60mph up the mountains in NC was no issue at all.

I towed around 5500lbs with my 1990 Bronco/351W/E4OD and you could definitely feel it struggle a bit.
 
The company has been heading into the shitter for a while now, hold onto your TJs boys



All this fuckery in the global auto industry & overall economy is really messing with my mojo which used to be the purchase of a new Japanese econo-box once per decade then flipping them into the next, 20k-ish price tag. This past April marked year 10 on my current box so I'm now in uncharted year #11 territory, around 110,000 miles, so far so good, I'm gonna try and drag this fucker over the 20 year finish line if possible. I maintain it well & don't beat on it so barring theft/collision I should be able to git'r done, we'll see. This is how little interest I have in dealing with these devil fucks & their over-inflated over-technology'd pieces of crap

Exactly what I am doing now. All of the family vehicles are 15+ years old. 2004 TJ Unlimited, 2004 4Runner, 2007 GX470. With my oldest just hitting the teen years and maybe heading off to boarding school I am currently researching at vehicle slightly better on gas mileage for road trips even that will probably be 15+ years old.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Zorba
When I bought my Jeep in NC, I towed it home on one of the U-Haul car carriers, so around 6k total weight.

I have a 2019 Ranger and it towed it effortlessly (it's rated for 7500).

60mph up the mountains in NC was no issue at all.

I towed around 5500lbs with my 1990 Bronco/351W/E4OD and you could definitely feel it struggle a bit.

I'm sure these trucks have plenty of power (probably overpowered), but do they have the brakes, chassis, cooling, and springs?
 
When I opined that somebody rich would buy Jeep, I was not considering the typical "you are failing so I will buy your most profitable line and give you cash" scenario from another car maker. I was thinking somebody RICH, like Zuckerberg, Ellison, Bezos, etc. Maybe someone who owns or owned a Jeep and remembers what they were and how they were used and doesn't really care about soccer moms and mall crawlers. It could be run like Musk runs Tesla, i.e. "who cares if we make any money this month?"
On another note, back in the day we used things called mini-computers or departmental computers. Think IBM AS-400 series. There were an almost immeasurable number of variables, which was why a computer program was developed to allow the sales guy and customer to configure their product correctly. Once configured, a computer specification file was sent to the factory where the computer was built and tested, then shipped to the user. Today, Cisco does the same thing with their complex products. Configuring an automobile or Jeep is child's play by comparison. The dealership could become a service facility, financing company, end-user prep station, and demo location, with all sales going straight to the mothership in the form of a config file that is built and shipped to the dealer for pickup by the end user. The days of the dealership getting 25% markup would go away. The company, like Ford does today, would have sophisticated analysis software to report which mods were selling and which were not, and which market segments were buying which options / configuration. This would allow the company to intelligently modify its product offerings to maximize their sales, minimize unneeded inventory, and max customer satisfaction. It would/should also radically reduce delivery times. This approach has been used in other types of businesses for at least 30 years.

The grandson of Chrysler sent them a buy notice, they refused. BYD was in their offices and one of the major shareholders would not allow the sale because of Maserati.

I am not sure who would buy them. Them as in Stellantis as a whole. We are only 1 presidency away from all electric and the buyers have spoken, they don't want them.

If Chrysler products could be spun out of that conglomerate it will take the likes of Carl Ichan and do a hostile shareholder activist play to pay them out.

But is there really anything left of value? Carl won't get involved unless the scrap value of the assets is greater than the purchase price in case it does not work out.

With global wokeness running rampant I don't think there will be many car companies standing in a decade or two.
 
Or benevolent OverLords won't let us have nice stuff - its all about the womb to tomb nanny state.

you-will-own-nothing-and-be-happy-v0-x5q5zijetpta1.jpg
 
  • Like
Reactions: John Cooper
If you rid the assembly line of all human intervention, it can be done.

If you want to see an incredible display of robotics, search a YT video on the VW parts warehouse in Germany. Every single part they make is in that warehouse and humans do not enter it. The parts are made, bagged, labeled/barcoded and that is the last time a human touches a part. Even boxed, labeled and shipped without human. Something to watch.

But as a business model, if you can group crap together that encompasses 7 items that are so so items, people will spend the $6k to get that fancier radio.

I'm not talking about the assembly line. I'm talking about all the setup done to make the assembly line work. Those robots still have to be told what parts to put on every vehicle and that still originates with humans, as of 2024.
 
What I find interesting is GM could handle this in the past. Even when computers were first integrated into production you could get separate Regular Production Options , (RPO 's) . A few Packages were available Like Super Sport , which included many RPO's ,but most were available separate.
Today's assembly lines and process's are almost fully automated , and production numbers are a joke in comparison to the past , ( In 1965 Chevy built 1 million Impala's alone ) . In 1983 I ordered a T-15 GMC with separate RPO's and built a cool little truck without crap I didn't want or have to pay for. I ordered it in mid April and picked it up in early June for $ 9555.15 .

As an earlier post suggested - we probably have orders of magnitude more "options" than in the 80s if they allowed line item ordering.

I'm not saying it's not possible, just that it takes a lot more manpower to set up on the front end, and they'll often choose not to do it in the face of project schedule and project cost (not vehicle cost or production time, but the cost and timeline to get from concept to production model) constraints.
 
Call me old fashioned, but I wouldn't pull that kind of weight with a half ton truck, much less a Jeep.

I get it , but it gets stupider as trucks get bigger. Would you tow 35,500 lbs. with a GMC 3500 reg.cab dooley 4X2 ? It seems brain dead to tow 35,500 with a 8000 lb. truck. In a field , sure I would , but on the highway I would feel much better with a real medium duty truck like a 4600 International , ( Not a tarted up 1 ton , Looking at you Ford F-550 , 5500 Ram ) .

like-new-1991-international-truck-4600-series-with-only-74000-miles-1.JPG
 
Call me old fashioned, but I wouldn't pull that kind of weight with a half ton truck, much less a Jeep.

I'm sure you know this, but "half ton" etc are completely arbitrary classifications. Weight and power specifications for a Gladiator would have fit right in with that of half ton trucks from 20 years ago, so it's tow rating falling in line with them as well is unsurprising.

I'm sure these trucks have plenty of power (probably overpowered), but do they have the brakes, chassis, cooling, and springs?

Given the financial consequences that would come from accidents resulting from overstating the tow capacity, or undersizing brakes, etc. they have to do some homework to come up with that number, as evidenced by the fact that they have different ratings based on the options the vehicle was built with that have nothing to do with throwing horsepower at it (such as wheelbase, axle ratio, curb weight, transmission).
 
have nothing to do with throwing horsepower at it (such as wheelbase, axle ratio, curb weight, transmission).

HP actually goes down as the truck sizes get bigger for Ford

Using 2023 numbers since they came up first.

F550
Gas 7.3L 225 HP and 468 lb-ft
Diesel 6.7L 330 HP and 950 lb-ft

F350
Gas 6.8L 405 HP and 445 lb-ft
Gas 7.3L 430 HP and 485 lb-ft
Diesel 6.7L 475 HP and 1,050 lb-ft
HP Diesel 6.7L 500 HP and 1,200 lb-ft

And for fun and todays numbers not 2023
Ranger Raptor
Gas 3.0L 455 HP and 536 lb-ft
 
  • Like
Reactions: freedom_in_4low
and they'll often choose not to do it in the face of project schedule and project cost (not vehicle cost or production time, but the cost and timeline to get from concept to production model) constraints.

These factors have always been with car manufacturing , this isn't a new challenge .

Today's engineering should have a much easier time with all the computer / IT advances . Yet it appears that we could do far more in the past in some ways , In a 1965 Impala you had 10 engine options , Today in a Wrangler you have 4 ,
And in a TJ you had a Mind blowing 2 . Think of the space race of the 1960's and now , Boeing screws up Airliner design safety / build that they have been the major player in for over 60 years. Now Boeing builds the Starliner spacecraft that strands astronuats on the space-station. Thankfully we have Wildman / Weirdos like Elon Musk that seem to get things done.

Who knows where all of this is headed.
 
Mihandra's are only expensive because of government import regulations. If they bought the line they could take over an old Stellanis factory and build/assemble them here.

Their Thar version sells in India for ~$13,500-27,000. The website lets you built the version you want like we are talking about. The larger diesel gets 12.5 km/liter or 29.4 mpg.

https://www.cardekho.com/mahindra/thar

I wonder what US safety and snooping tech requirements add to the cost. I read the government requires remote kill switches in future cars. I guess for safety?

Mahindra tried bringing their vehicles here. Had a few delays and then the dealers got in a pissing match with them and they walked away.

Yes, Mahindra Thar and BYD Tank are squarely aimed at the Wrangler. With a Wrangler 2x to 3x the price of the other two, it's future world wide presence is dire.
 
HP actually goes down as the truck sizes get bigger for Ford

Using 2023 numbers since they came up first.

F550
Gas 7.3L 225 HP and 468 lb-ft
Diesel 6.7L 330 HP and 950 lb-ft

F350
Gas 6.8L 405 HP and 445 lb-ft
Gas 7.3L 430 HP and 485 lb-ft
Diesel 6.7L 475 HP and 1,050 lb-ft
HP Diesel 6.7L 500 HP and 1,200 lb-ft

And for fun and todays numbers not 2023
Ranger Raptor
Gas 3.0L 455 HP and 536 lb-ft

As HP increases, life span decreases. HP is an engine killer. There has to be a few million dump trucks running around with a half million miles sporting a meager 300 HP.
 
  • Like
  • USA Proud
Reactions: ColoJeep and Zorba
Novak Conversions Jeep Wrangler TJ engine mounts