Novak Conversions Jeep Wrangler TJ radiator

This is why your dash speakers suck

I should have mentioned I'm using a mid priced Sony head unit, no external amp, & factory sub.
I can hear the (4) 5.25 Polks good enough, just looking for a little extra.

Try to find a place where you can listen to the different options in your price range and see what you like best. Bring your own music with different songs to try out.

Obviously can't do that if you're buying everything online though. Just have to read the reviews. I've never been a fan of Kicker, but anything is better than stock. I had some JL separates in a previous Jeep that sounded nice and clean. I have JL Coaxials in my LJ that sound decent.
 
I copied this upgrade with minor tweaks. I mounted the speaker to the back of the adapter plate to give it a little more clearance in front of the wrap-around baffle. I put the aluminum flashing baffle between the adapter plate and speaker.

Sound is better, and there's even OK bass when the jeep is off. It's plenty loud enough to understand the music with no top or doors at 70, but still weak bottom end. I still need to put in a sub.

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I copied this upgrade with minor tweaks. I mounted the speaker to the back of the adapter plate to give it a little more clearance in front of the wrap-around baffle. I put the aluminum flashing baffle between the adapter plate and speaker.

Sound is better, and there's even OK bass when the jeep is off. It's plenty loud enough to understand the music with no top or doors at 70, but still weak bottom end. I still need to put in a sub.

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I am confused how this solution is better than the pods they sell? I have the pods that have been lined with sound dampening. Kicker 5.25” in front. 6.5” sound bar, 10” sub self powered

Alpine deck and powerpack.
 
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I am confused how this solution is better than the pods they sell? I have the pods that have been lined with sound dampening. Kicker 5.25” in front. 6.5” sound bar, 10” sub self powered

Alpine deck and powerpack.

I don't think Pods are in the picture here, it was an inexpensive upgrade. Pods would be more beneficial, but you are also paying for it, so some people rather pay a little for a big improvement rather than a lot for a bigger improvement - the value.

Personally I would spend money relocating the tweeters before buying the 5.25" pods...Kicker has a couple great options, one is a 5.25" component and the second is to eliminate the 5.25" speaker and change with a 2.5" that sits up high on your dash.

https://www.crutchfield.com/p_20647KSS50/Kicker-47KSS504.html
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https://www.crutchfield.com/p_20647KSMT2/Kicker-47KSMT2504.html

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I am confused how this solution is better than the pods they sell? I have the pods that have been lined with sound dampening. Kicker 5.25” in front. 6.5” sound bar, 10” sub self powered

Alpine deck and powerpack.
Because a 5 1/4” car stereo speaker is designed to work properly in a large air space, such as a door. By installing one in a tiny plastic pod, you seriously limit the low end and color the midrange, especially in the region of a male voice. I tried the pods hooked up to my home stereo, and they made my speakers sound like someone speaking with their hands cupped around their mouth or like the sound was originating from the bottom of a tin can. The speakers sounded fundamentally different than they did even using a cardboard box as a makeshift enclosure, and not for the better.
 
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Because a 5 1/4” car stereo speaker is designed to work properly in a large air space, such as a door. By installing one in a tiny plastic pod, you seriously limit the low end and color the midrange, especially in the region of a male voice. I tried the pods hooked up to my home stereo, and they made my speakers sound like someone speaking with their hands cupped around their mouth or like the sound was originating from the bottom of a tin can. The speakers sounded fundamentally different than they did even using a cardboard box as a makeshift enclosure, and not for the better.
I have listened to a few TJ systems and I disagree with the pods being small and limiting. Also the metal bracket the speakers used to screw into was awful design.

I don’t disagree that the OP did is. Great budget option. I was extremely pleased with pods lined with dampening material.

Hardest part about audio is everyone seems to do their system a little different. Lots of no sub owners. Lots of no amp owners. Lots of cheap head unit which also causes issues with reliable power.

I think if most people try their best to solve the sub, amp, and uplift Head unit. We all would be better equipped to understand the issue.

I do like the idea of a tweeter on the A Pillar but don’t like the idea of it being so exposed.
 
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I have listened to a few TJ systems and I disagree with the pods being small and limiting. Also the metal bracket the speakers used to screw into was awful design.

I don’t disagree that the OP did is. Great budget option. I was extremely pleased with pods lined with dampening material.

Hardest part about audio is everyone seems to do their system a little different. Lots of no sub owners. Lots of no amp owners. Lots of cheap head unit which also causes issues with reliable power.

I think if most people try their best to solve the sub, amp, and uplift Head unit. We all would be better equipped to understand the issue.

I do like the idea of a tweeter on the A Pillar but don’t like the idea of it being so exposed.

I may not be running a sub, but I’m using a quality amp and head unit. I installed stereos professionally for a few years in the early to mid ‘90s, and have a number of high quality home stereo systems (NOT home theater systems) in my living room, family room, and master bedroom. I’m using NAD, Cambridge Audio, PSB, B&W, and Paradigm gear. I used songs I’m familiar with to test the pods.

All this is to lend support when I say I know what the music used to audition the pods is supposed to sound like.

The pods sound like crap, but they’re still the best bolt in option out there due to the TJ dash design. I’m considering installing an aperiodic vent in the rear of the pod to simulate a larger airspace, but the horrible design of the TJ dash would probably still subject the speakers to phase cancellation.

Perhaps if the pods are crossed over with a high pass filter set to 150hz or higher they wouldn’t be so useless.
 
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I may not be running a sub, but I’m using a quality amp and head unit. I installed stereos professionally for a few years in the early to mid ‘90s, and have a number of high quality home stereo systems (NOT home theater systems) in my living room, family room, and master bedroom. I’m using NAD, Cambridge Audio, PSB, B&W, and Paradigm gear. I used songs I’m familiar with to test the pods.

All this is to lend support when I say I know what the music used to audition the pods is supposed to sound like.

The pods sound like crap, but they’re still the best bolt in option out there due to the TJ dash design. I’m considering installing an aperiodic vent in the rear of the pod to simulate a larger airspace, but the horrible design of the TJ dash would probably still subject the speakers to phase cancellation.

Perhaps if the pods are crossed over with a high pass filter set to 150hz or higher they wouldn’t be so useless.
Why not cut out the back of pod a bit?

I also have been doing home theater as well as high end 2.1 systems for many years. Trust me I understand high quality audio is a fools errand in a Tj

I just looked at the TJ design and could easily see the pods are the best option to fix all the main issues
 
Why not cut out the back of pod a bit?

I also have been doing home theater as well as high end 2.1 systems for many years. Trust me I understand high quality audio is a fools errand in a Tj

I just looked at the TJ design and could easily see the pods are the best option to fix all the main issues
I had limited time after installing the pods to experiment with them; I was leaving for Moab the next day. I ended up with two 1/2" holes in the back of each, and using the included polyfill to try and damp the response. Cutting a larger hole would likely eliminate the only thing the pods do right, which is eliminating the phase cancellation of a speaker playing without a proper baffle.
I also have been doing home theater as well as high end 2.1 systems for many years. Trust me I understand high quality audio is a fools errand in a Tj
While I can agree with that wholeheartedly, I'm looking for high quality audio. My goal is to make the stereo sound better than a < $15 clock radio. I want to be able to turn on the radio and not be so annoyed by the tinniness to immediately turn it back off. I would love to be able to listen to NPR and clearly understand what they're saying while I'm driving down the highway with my top and windows up (soft uppers).

I just looked at the TJ design and could easily see the pods are the best option to fix all the main issues
The pods absolutely do solve the phase cancellation issue, but they create other issues such as overdamping of the speaker. It's a pretty big tradeoff.

Who knows, maybe I'll try the aperiodic vent, maybe I'll build some fiberglass kick panels for the front speakers, maybe I'll install a small sub and cross the fronts over at a pretty high frequency, or maybe I'll just remove the stereo altogether.

All I'm trying to say is the pods aren't a panacea. If there is a better way to seal up the dash and drastically reduce phase cancellation like the OP did with cardboard and tape, it's likely it sounds better when fed a full range signal than the pods do.
 
I still will say that the biggest improvement in my TJ was replacing the base speakers for the factory Infinity speakers. I only use the stereo in the TJ at slow speeds, highway speeds you can hardly talk to the passenger...

have a number of high quality home stereo systems (NOT home theater systems) in my living room, family room, and master bedroom. I’m using NAD, Cambridge Audio, PSB, B&W, and Paradigm gear.
I too have high end audio in house. My HiFi is Dynaco electronics with KEF speakers. I use Yamaha Aventage and B&W for my theater's 7.2.2 system...

I will not spend good money for mobile audio further than what the factory had as their best, save for the head unit... but only to add features like BT and car play functionality.
 
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@89grand (if you’re still here) thanks for this thread and sticking around as long as you did. I fell for the "internet wisdom" and bought the Speaker Pods. They sound like garbage to me, though others might enjoy what they gain from them more than they dislike what they sacrifice In terms of sound.

The general problem, in my opinion, is that audio is so subjective and everyone’s "ears" are different. And it’s not actual "ears," there are just different things that people enjoy. The pods might make a certain mid-bass frequency peak so it sounds "fuller" or like there’s more bass, and some people might like that. Or it might just fill the hole in the sound that person felt was missing. Others might hear a certain frequency that’s pronounced, and also realize certain frequencies are now more subdued.

As I’ve learned more about this, full-range car speakers aren’t designed primarily to go in a sealed box. They’re certainly not designed or tuned with any particular box in mind. If you look at, for example, Infinity Kappa instructions they give you the numbers you’d need if you wanted to use a sealed box. And those numbers say that anything smaller than 7 liters (almost 2 gallons) will damp the speaker cone. In other words, any box smaller than a 2 gallon container is reducing the amount the speaker cone deflects. For a Sound engineer, this could be useful if he wanted to run much higher power than the speaker was rated for, but it would require careful calculation of a bunch of factors To calculate the right amount of power and box volume. Then people say "fill it with polyfil" but how much you need, how much will damage your speaker, and whether or not it makes enough difference is another whole topic.

So a few years ago, before knowing this, I bought the Sound Pods. They change the sound, there’s more of a certain frequency of bass, but there’s less deeper bass. And my "ears" hear it sounding less smooth, like certain frequencies are missing. The stock speaker upgrades come in a box, but it’s worth noting the speaker cone travels so little (plus other parameters) that its minimum required volume is going to be way, way smaller. And maybe the engineers decided that overall sound and bass output was lower, but the frequency spike from the box filled in a gap they felt was needed.

Have you ever heard someone blast a stereo and comment about how good it sounded, while you thought it sounded like crap? I have, plenty of times. Maybe my "ears" suck to them, maybe there’s do to me, or maybe we just value different audible sensations in our free time.

I have 5.25 JBL studio monitors at similar power levels to my 5.25 Jeep speakers. The monitors get loud enough to annoy neighbors a block away and there’s enough bass to make movies quite exciting. So this whole thing that 5.25 speakers will never have volume bass is also BS, whether they’re pointed at your or not. There are 2 issues: one is similar to what ultra d wrote about, is all the other crap and gaps behind the dash. 5.25" speakers in a sealed door (that’s volume is close to or bigger than 2 gallons) will sound plenty loud and full.

The other thing that 89grand addressed but didn’t discuss is placement of the tweeters. High frequencies are directional, so tweeters pointing at your knees will lose things like the upper end of a cymbal splash. Using bright metal dome tweeters, or an EQ boost can help a lot.

Last, arguing that chasing sound in a Jeep is also BS. I’m not saying it will ever be as good as something else, but attacking someone for trying to just have the most amount of good, clean music they can get is BS. On the highway i obviously loose a shot ton of music detail, but what I do hear is something that’s as pleasing as possible to my ears. If it were tinny, over-powered mid range with no treble or bass, I’d never crank it on the highway to begin with.

Anyway, in the original post I certainly heard more ringing/vibrations in the un-affected speaker, and the modded side sounded better. It certainly wasn’t studio quality sound - nobody’s saying it is - but for a small amount of money and time it was better, to my ears.

It’s funny, most people here would support a TJ owner wanting a 1" lift, but getting 1" of better sound quality seems like heresy to some people.
 
@89grand (if you’re still here) thanks for this thread and sticking around as long as you did. I fell for the "internet wisdom" and bought the Speaker Pods. They sound like garbage to me, though others might enjoy what they gain from them more than they dislike what they sacrifice In terms of sound.

The general problem, in my opinion, is that audio is so subjective and everyone’s "ears" are different. And it’s not actual "ears," there are just different things that people enjoy. The pods might make a certain mid-bass frequency peak so it sounds "fuller" or like there’s more bass, and some people might like that. Or it might just fill the hole in the sound that person felt was missing. Others might hear a certain frequency that’s pronounced, and also realize certain frequencies are now more subdued.

As I’ve learned more about this, full-range car speakers aren’t designed primarily to go in a sealed box. They’re certainly not designed or tuned with any particular box in mind. If you look at, for example, Infinity Kappa instructions they give you the numbers you’d need if you wanted to use a sealed box. And those numbers say that anything smaller than 7 liters (almost 2 gallons) will damp the speaker cone. In other words, any box smaller than a 2 gallon container is reducing the amount the speaker cone deflects. For a Sound engineer, this could be useful if he wanted to run much higher power than the speaker was rated for, but it would require careful calculation of a bunch of factors To calculate the right amount of power and box volume. Then people say "fill it with polyfil" but how much you need, how much will damage your speaker, and whether or not it makes enough difference is another whole topic.

So a few years ago, before knowing this, I bought the Sound Pods. They change the sound, there’s more of a certain frequency of bass, but there’s less deeper bass. And my "ears" hear it sounding less smooth, like certain frequencies are missing. The stock speaker upgrades come in a box, but it’s worth noting the speaker cone travels so little (plus other parameters) that its minimum required volume is going to be way, way smaller. And maybe the engineers decided that overall sound and bass output was lower, but the frequency spike from the box filled in a gap they felt was needed.

Have you ever heard someone blast a stereo and comment about how good it sounded, while you thought it sounded like crap? I have, plenty of times. Maybe my "ears" suck to them, maybe there’s do to me, or maybe we just value different audible sensations in our free time.

I have 5.25 JBL studio monitors at similar power levels to my 5.25 Jeep speakers. The monitors get loud enough to annoy neighbors a block away and there’s enough bass to make movies quite exciting. So this whole thing that 5.25 speakers will never have volume bass is also BS, whether they’re pointed at your or not. There are 2 issues: one is similar to what ultra d wrote about, is all the other crap and gaps behind the dash. 5.25" speakers in a sealed door (that’s volume is close to or bigger than 2 gallons) will sound plenty loud and full.

The other thing that 89grand addressed but didn’t discuss is placement of the tweeters. High frequencies are directional, so tweeters pointing at your knees will lose things like the upper end of a cymbal splash. Using bright metal dome tweeters, or an EQ boost can help a lot.

Last, arguing that chasing sound in a Jeep is also BS. I’m not saying it will ever be as good as something else, but attacking someone for trying to just have the most amount of good, clean music they can get is BS. On the highway i obviously loose a shot ton of music detail, but what I do hear is something that’s as pleasing as possible to my ears. If it were tinny, over-powered mid range with no treble or bass, I’d never crank it on the highway to begin with.

Anyway, in the original post I certainly heard more ringing/vibrations in the un-affected speaker, and the modded side sounded better. It certainly wasn’t studio quality sound - nobody’s saying it is - but for a small amount of money and time it was better, to my ears.

It’s funny, most people here would support a TJ owner wanting a 1" lift, but getting 1" of better sound quality seems like heresy to some people.

Your pod experience was the same as mine. I hated the way they sounded. However, after posting in this thread previously, I added a sub and crossed the pods over at 150hz. That made a significant difference for the better. The pods do work, but I’d rather run OEM speakers than the pods at full range. With them crossed over at a high enough frequency, they sounded worlds better.
 
If I want better sound quality I'll listen to my home audio system. I definitely didn't buy my TJ for playing music in. It plays The Rolling Stones well enough and loud enough for me while I'm using my TJ for what I bought it for, wheeling.
 
I gained more listening pleasure from sound deadener and thick carpet. Than I think I would by investing in an expensive system. And even with the SD, with a soft top, trying to improve sound seems like your beyond the point of diminishing returns. A Jeep TJ just isn't built for superior stereo sound quality.

Prior to laying down 80ml sound deadener, heat sheild and the thickest carpet they make - I couldn't hear shit on the freeway. Like literally, all I think you could do at that point is increase volume. But it would still sound like crap trying to fight engine, road noise and other traffic.

I opted for a midrange (or maybe its low range) Kenwood single din with Polk speakers in the dash and sound bar. I also used the foam pods in the dash and poly stuffing in the sound bar. I can now hear music and podcasts at an enjoyable volume level. With enough clarity to satisfy my uneducated ears.

I am most certainly not an audiophile. But if I were I think the last thing I would buy is a Jeep TJ. I personally think the sweet spot is comprehensive sound deadening and an average system. Its at that cost level that your probably going to get 90% of your return on investment. The other 10% is reserved for audiophiles with many more times the investment in equipment.

But sound deadening also makes it difficult to hose out your Jeep. So if your in it just for the wheeling I'd definitely not invest in sound deadening beyond say remivable mat under bedrug carpet.

Until you can invest in sound deadening, the massive amount if noise in a soft top Jeep, makes overcoming that with equipment a fools errand IMHO.

But again, I am very much not an audiophile. I simply want clarity. Meaning I can hear my music at an acceptable level, clear enough to not be reminded of the cacophony of noise emanating from every corner inside my Jeep.
 
Pretty cool as a scientist, but as an Engineer not so much.....

On a particularly steep hill, the car’s brakes fail.

The car rockets down the hill at terrifying speed - and winds up in a ditch.

The mathematician calculates the failure rate of brakes, the final impact velocity based on the slope and air resistance - and concludes that they had a lucky escape.

The physicist works out the rate of brake wear, the pressure on the pads, the heating due to friction and concludes that the mathematician should have replaced his brake pads sooner.

The software engineer says “I know, let’s push it back up to the top of the hill and see if it does it again”.
 
Drove my Jeep home 1200 miles home in June with no carpet, bare floors, and a soft top.

Just redid the entire interior sealed, sound deadener, new ~$1000 system, and new carpet.

My honest opinion is summer time top open, I cant notice ANY difference the sound deadener & carpet made, and Im a big stereo guy. Frankly theres just too much wind noise to contend with for it to make a difference. Focus more on speakers and sub

This will assuredly change with a hard top in winter. However initial perspective is I didnt notice enough change to warrant a “this is absolutely necessary” for summertime usage

As for front speaker location, yeah it just sucks no matter how many bandaids ya put on it. This is a common issue in almost all vehicles. Best end result I found is speaker pods + components and the tweeters up on the dash
I am confused how this solution is better than the pods they sell? I have the pods that have been lined with sound dampening. Kicker 5.25” in front. 6.5” sound bar, 10” sub self powered

Alpine deck and powerpack.

I did a few different attempts
This is by far the best solution WITH components up front. The only exception is it may also benefit from surrounding the speaker lip with 1” foam to direct all sound forward
 
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Seems as it would be a lot easier, cheaper, and sound better to get some high end headphones.

Its funny you say this
I just thought this the other day watching a guy driving in his F150 with wired earbuds in. I was like…hmmm, he didnt wanna bother upgrading his stereo 🤣
 
Novak Conversions Jeep Wrangler TJ radiator