Who on here is the go-to for discussing a stroker build?

[macleanflood]

Still trying to figure out why one would spend the $$ on roller for what is basically a tractor engine, but maybe I'm missing something.

Mostly because of the endemic problem of wiping out modern flat tappet cams. Nobody can seem to cast/grind a decent cam, or lifters.

There's a high percentage of failure.

A roller cam means you're not rolling the dice. Allegedly and theoretically.

I wonder what a 4.0 sounds like with a roller cam.

-Mac

 

[Wildman]

Mostly because of the endemic problem of wiping out modern flat tappet cams. Nobody can seem to cast/grind a decent cam, or lifters.

There's a high percentage of failure.

A roller cam means you're not rolling the dice. Allegedly and theoretically.

I wonder what a 4.0 sounds like with a roller cam.

-Mac

If you read through a lot of stroker builds YES this seems to be a issue but more so when trying to run a high lift/duration cam. If you are running something more stockish they seem to have less issues.

On the subject of HPTuners and getting a tune, if you don't have any other the equipment budget $1200-1500 if you're paying someone to do your tuning. And I can't say on a stroker but even on a stock Dodge Magnum V-8 getting a tune done (even a canned tune) was a huge improvement over stock. Just like the 4.0 the Magnum engines did not have a knock sensor so they'd retarded the timing a LOT to stop them from pinging.

 

[LJBean]

Mostly because of the endemic problem of wiping out modern flat tappet cams. Nobody can seem to cast/grind a decent cam, or lifters.

There's a high percentage of failure.

A roller cam means you're not rolling the dice. Allegedly and theoretically.

I wonder what a 4.0 sounds like with a roller cam.

If you read through a lot of stroker builds YES this seems to be a issue but more so when trying to run a high lift/duration cam. If you are running something more stockish they seem to have less issues.

On the subject of HPTuners and getting a tune, if you don't have any other the equipment budget $1200-1500 if you're paying someone to do your tuning. And I can't say on a stroker but even on a stock Dodge Magnum V-8 getting a tune done (even a canned tune) was a huge improvement over stock. Just like the 4.0 the Magnum engines did not have a knock sensor so they'd retarded the timing a LOT to stop them from pinging.

Not arguing the benefits of a roller cam and lifters over flat tappet, but questioning the benefit on the 4.0 as compared to going with the V8 swap from a cost vs. performance standpoint.

 

[Rickyd]

Not arguing the benefits of a roller cam and lifters over flat tappet, but questioning the benefit on the 4.0 as compared to going with the V8 swap from a cost vs. performance standpoint.

Unless you are swapping in a dodge Magnum in a state where they allow that, v8 swaps aren't cheap. You need a transmission and a load of other parts.

With that in mind adding 500$ on top of the custom grind nitrided cam I have isn't a deal breaker to me. I want more cam and a tune at some point.

Besides,I've already went full retard. Edelbrock head,high compression forged pistons,forged rods with arp bolts,moly rings.whats another 1000$?

 

[TJosh02]

On the subject of stroker vs. V8....

Here in Ontario, it is easier to mod your engine a bit and still have insurance coverage, but if you swap your engine it becomes a "Hot rod" and very few insurance companies will cover you, even if it is 'legal'. Without insurance it is defacto illegal. Currently, there is only 2 companies that will insure a Jeep with any mods at all. My previous insurer dropped me when they found I wasn't on stock wheels.

99% of the hundreds of folks in my Jeep club use Allstate, myself included, because they are basically the only guy in town that will insure a modded vehicle.

It is basically the insurance companies that hold the cards here.

 

[jeepguy03]

Unless you are swapping in a dodge Magnum in a state where they allow that, v8 swaps aren't cheap. You need a transmission and a load of other parts.

With that in mind adding 500$ on top of the custom grind nitrided cam I have isn't a deal breaker to me. I want more cam and a tune at some point.

Besides,I've already went full retard. Edelbrock head,high compression forged pistons,forged rods with arp bolts,moly rings.whats another 1000$?

100%. The huge benefit of a stroker is that it literally bolts in place of the 4.0L and doesn't require other supporting mods. A V8 swap (like @Rickyd mentioned) will be a lot of $$$ and require lots of fabrication. Engine mounts, wiring and control, exhaust/intake, fueling, transmission upgrades, other fitment issues such as the steering shaft, etc. For performance, the V8 definitely wins because you have more options, but for the money a stroker is hard to beat for something that bolts right in place of the existing engine.

 

[jeepguy03]

On the subject of stroker vs. V8....

Here in Ontario, it is easier to mod your engine a bit and still have insurance coverage, but if you swap your engine it becomes a "Hot rod" and very few insurance companies will cover you, even if it is 'legal'. Without insurance it is defacto illegal. Currently, there is only 2 companies that will insure a Jeep with any mods at all. My previous insurer dropped me when they found I wasn't on stock wheels.

99% of the hundreds of folks in my Jeep club use Allstate, myself included, because they are basically the only guy in town that will insure a modded vehicle.

It is basically the insurance companies that hold the cards here.

Another good point. I used to work in auto insurance, the minute the insurance company found out their insured's vehicle was "significantly modified" such as a large lift, much larger tires, etc, without notifying them, they considered that a loop in the policy and denied coverage. It was really shitty, but I remember seeing people in lifted trucks who had to pay out of pocket for the medical bills of others in an accident because their insurance company denied them coverage claiming the lift contributed to more damage and risk in the accident over a stock vehicle.

 

[mrblaine]

Hasn’t Blaine been waiting well over a year for his stroker build from Russ? Maybe I misheard.

If by well over a year you mean 4 years last month, then you are correct. Sadly, I was only able to get him to agree to build one through some of his close friends. They told me if I would follow the rules, he would build it. I couldn't call or contact him and bother him about it, expect it to be at least 8 months to a year before it was done, and I had to deliver the core block to him. I agreed to the rules and followed them to the letter.

After 3 years of not getting it and no updates from Russ, I asked his friends if it would be okay to just check on it to see if it was going to even happen. They were astounded I did not have any updates or the engine. As such, they said sure, go ahead and bother him.

I sent him an email wanting to know if this was going to happen and if not, tell me where my block is so I can go fetch it up. He replied that he had the head done.

No update for when, no update for even if it would still be built, just "I have the head done". I have not bothered him since. I'm pretty much over it.

Through other sources, I learned that he has had some personal issues of a family nature which has interfered with him having any time to spend on building an engine.

EDIT- it was brought to my attention that some fuckwits are trying to let their personal opinions to paint an alternate reality. The above is 100% verifiable and I can post up the email if anyone is in doubt.

 

[speeding_infraction]

Does he have any of your money?

 

[mrblaine]

Does he have any of your money?

I'm patient, not stupid.

 

[Rickyd]

On the subject of stroker vs. V8....

Here in Ontario, it is easier to mod your engine a bit and still have insurance coverage, but if you swap your engine it becomes a "Hot rod" and very few insurance companies will cover you, even if it is 'legal'. Without insurance it is defacto illegal. Currently, there is only 2 companies that will insure a Jeep with any mods at all. My previous insurer dropped me when they found I wasn't on stock wheels.

99% of the hundreds of folks in my Jeep club use Allstate, myself included, because they are basically the only guy in town that will insure a modded vehicle.

It is basically the insurance companies that hold the cards here.

I went the stroker route because of the nazi smog state I'm in. So long as it burns clean they'll never know!

 

[ColoJeep]

On the subject of stroker vs. V8....

Here in Ontario, it is easier to mod your engine a bit and still have insurance coverage, but if you swap your engine it becomes a "Hot rod" and very few insurance companies will cover you, even if it is 'legal'. Without insurance it is defacto illegal. Currently, there is only 2 companies that will insure a Jeep with any mods at all. My previous insurer dropped me when they found I wasn't on stock wheels.

99% of the hundreds of folks in my Jeep club use Allstate, myself included, because they are basically the only guy in town that will insure a modded vehicle.

It is basically the insurance companies that hold the cards here.

Colorado is a pain to deal with in the last 10 - 15 years , But reading this post makes me glad to be here and not in Canada . Government overreach sucks , it turns into control and stealing more money . I would go down the stroker rabbit hole to " hide in plain sight ' since I'm forced into emission testing .

 

[Wildman]

Not trying to argue the merits of a V-8 swap over a stroker, I know some places have strict rules on engine swaps or what type of engine you can use. And as Rick said unless it's a Magnum swap it's going to get pretty spendy. And honestly now with most rigs being 20+ years old that would have a Magnum in them you're still going to spend a LOT since I wouldn't swap a drivetrain into my rig that had more than 100K miles on it without rebuilding it.

And I'm no expert on the 4. or what mods you can do & what benefits are going to help but just like on a V-8 a roller valve train is going to free up some power since it's less resistance. And as Rick said what's another $500-1,000 when you're this deep into a build?

 

[GoldenGorilla]

And as Rick said what's another $500-1,000 when you're this deep into a build?

I've priced it out and it's quite a bit more than that by the time you're done. I'm still going that route. Still makes me a bit nervous as it isn't "proven" on this platform even though every other pushrod made in the last 30 years has used them.

 

[Woodrow]

I went the stroker route because of the nazi smog state I'm in. So long as it burns clean they'll never know!

Did you need to tune it specifically to pass the smog test or did it just come out OK once you were done?

 

[Rickyd]

Did you need to tune it specifically to pass the smog test or did it just come out OK once you were done?

No tune or smog yet,but I've seen other russ spec strokers pass smog in southern ca. With the high compression i hope the nox wouldn't be too high.

My rural county only needs a smog on transfer of ownership or moving into state.

That doesn't mean cops won't lift your hood and look for violations though. And it makes resale very difficult If you can't pass.

 

[LJBean]

No tune or smog yet,but I've seen other russ spec strokers pass smog in southern ca. With the high compression i hope the nox wouldn't be too high.

My rural county only needs a smog on transfer of ownership or moving into state.

That doesn't mean cops won't lift your hood and look for violations though. And it makes resale very difficult If you can't pass.

I don't know how you all can tolerate that bullshit. There are good jobs elsewhere.

 

[Wildman]

I've priced it out and it's quite a bit more than that by the time you're done. I'm still going that route. Still makes me a bit nervous as it isn't "proven" on this platform even though every other pushrod made in the last 30 years has used them.

Approximately how much more is it? I was using the cost of V-8 roller rockers as my estimate.

 

[sierradmax]

OK getting back on topic, What's a good tool to measure piston deck height?

Then, what's a good online calculator to input values and spit out the CR? I want to confirm what my current CR is before making any rash decisions.

thanks..

 

[GoldenGorilla]

Approximately how much more is it? I was using the cost of V-8 roller rockers as my estimate.

For just the billet cam and hydraulic roller lifters about $1550, but you also need a mellonized gear for the cam sensor/distributor, new pushrods, cam bearings that aren't made of jello and a few other things and quickly it's over 2k.