2004 TJ 4.0 - Want 3" Lift and 33s - Not sure how to get there

[mtg]

Hey all! Last week I bought a 2004 Sahara 5 speed from the original owner with 113k miles. This is my first Jeep and it will be used as a daily driver for the most part. It's 100% factory right now and other than a modest lift and slightly larger tires, I plan to keep it that way.

I've spent a decent amount of time researching suspension components, and my head is currently spinning with the amount of options there are. But I've narrowed down my questions/choices (I think) to the following and am hoping to get some answers, opinions and advice on:

• (For context, my TJ has factory Dana 30 front and Dana 44 rear with 3.73 gearing)
• 3 inch lift from BDS. Good? Price is not a concern.
• Are the Nitro shocks okay or should I upgrade to Fox?
• I do not want a BL as I do not like the look and do not want to replace motor mounts. Do you think I have to add one to fit 33s? I'm not doing extreme wheeling, but off-road trail use (in FL), yes. Why does it seem like everyone runs a BL on here
• What is a tummy tuck, why is it so common?
• Do I need new control arms? I see they do not come with the above kit.
• I also want to improve the steering. Does anyone have recommendations on what to purchase for that?
• Anything else I should consider upgrading at the moment? Do I need new driveshafts or brake lines with a 3 inch?

Edit: Added a picture!

 

[RangerTJ]

With a 3" lift you will likely need the SYE and a new driveshaft.

While some body lifts do indeed look tacky, the 1.25" from BMB looks right and is barely noticeable.

I'm running the BMB body lift and 2.5" springs to clear 33" tires (285/70/17).

I initially tried 3" springs but got driveshaft vibrations.

 

[Chris]

[*]3 inch lift from BDS. Good? Price is not a concern.

Yes, but I wouldn't go this route if I were you. You need 4" of lift total to run 33s and maintaining factory up-travel.

If you're smart you'll go with a 2.5" suspension lift and a 1.25" body lift, for a total of 3.75" of lift which will be perfect for 33s. In addition, you'll save a lot of money.

See this thread, this is the route you should go: A recipe for an affordable but quality 2.5" lift

[*]Are the Nitro shocks okay or should I upgrade to Fox?

Both are meh but I wouldn't pay to upgrade to those Fox shocks. Those Fox shocks are nothing special (they aren't the higher end specially tuned Fox shocks).

[*]I do not want a BL as I do not like the look and do not want to replace motor mounts. Do you think I have to add one to fit 33s? I'm not doing extreme wheeling, but off-road trail use (in FL), yes. Why does it seem like everyone runs a BL on here

Bad idea, trust me. A body lift is a great thing, one of the best things you can do to your TJ. You're doing yourself a huge disservice by being so opposed to one. A 1.25" BL is a gold standard for lifted TJs. The reason everyone on here runs a BL is because they've done their research. A body lift allows you to get extra lift from your TJ without worrying about any driveline angle related problems (new driveshafts, control arms, etc.). It also allows you to run a tummy tuck.

[*]What is a tummy tuck, why is it so common?

It lifts the low hanging transfer case up and tucks it further into the body / frame which is what you want if you're playing off-road in the rocks. In Florida you won't need to worry about this since there are no rocks. However, if you plan to take your TJ to places where you'll be wheeling in serious rocks, you'll need a tummy tuck or else you'll get your transfer case hung up on everything.

[*]Do I need new control arms? I see they do not come with the above kit.

At 3" of suspension lift you will want adjustable control arms, yes.

[*]I also want to improve the steering. Does anyone have recommendations on what to purchase for that?

See here: What is the best steering for my Jeep Wrangler TJ?

[*]Anything else I should consider upgrading at the moment? Do I need new driveshafts or brake lines with a 3 inch?

3" is tricky and you need to get away from this attachment to 3". I don't know where you came up with this number but it's wrong for 33s.

Do yourself a favor and check out this thread: A recipe for an affordable but quality 2.5" lift

That is the route I would highly encourage you to go.

I'm also going to highly suggest you read some of the threads in the TJ Resources forum. You'll thank me later!

 

[KennethS]

I bought my ‘98 back in 2002 with a 2” OME lift and 32” tires. Other than the springs, shocks, brake relocation brackets, and sway bar disconnects it was all factory. The wife daily drove it for many years like that with no issues at all before it became a backup vehicle. It’s still on 32s with 2” lift and handles all of my off-road wheeling adventures here in Arizona.

 

[mtg]

Yes, but I wouldn't go this route if I were you. You need 4" of lift total to run 33s and maintaining factory up-travel.

If you're smart you'll go with a 2.5" suspension lift and a 1.25" body lift, for a total of 3.75" of lift which will be perfect for 33s. In addition, you'll save a lot of money.

See this thread, this is the route you should go: A recipe for an affordable but quality 2.5" lift

Chris, thanks for the information and quick reply. In your recipe for an affordable lift, you list only Rancho shocks. Are those the best? Better than the Fox or Nitro ones I listed above? I know it's surface level, but I absolutely hate the white and red look of those shocks. Just looks cheap to me. What other shocks would you recommend? What about OME, I see a lot of people on here running a 2.5inch OME + 1.25 BL. The odd thing is that there are no kits on ARB's website for OME. How do I know what parts to buy?

Also, now that I've been looking at 2.5" suspension and 1.25" BL as you suggested, I see a lot of people running 35s on this set up.

The reason I bring up 35s is because I really want to run flat fenders like this on my TJ because I absolutely love that look. However, I worry that 33s will look far too small with those fenders. Thoughts?

 

[DaveC]

I'm on 33s, running OME springs and shocks for a 2-2.5" lift, along with a 1.25" body lift.

OME spring part #2932 front and 2941 rear. Shocks 60047 front and 60048 rear.

My TJ is fairly light and I wound up with right about 2.7" of lift from the springs (OEM front bumper, no winch, soft top and no rear seat).

The Rancho and Sky Jacker Black Max shocks are liked my many here. Some like the OME shocks, some don't, but I've been really happy with them.

I wouldn't let the color of the shocks influence your decision. I'm not a huge fan of the yellow OME, but really don't notice it any more, and you can always paint whatever you end up with if you're not a fan of the color.

 

[TheBoogieman]

FWIW, I measured my 8 year old Zone 3" springs yesterday to see how much they've sagged over the years. Front was 15" and rear was 11" (stock 12 / 8").

 

[MikekiM]

If you're looking to use it primarily off road, the advice you get from our forum members is going to spot on. That said...

My 2000 is a daily driver with benign offroad use a few times a months.. mainly rocky unmaintained fire roads to and from dispersed base camps, and outer-beach sand.

Check my profile for all the bits, but short story is 33x12.5's Falken WildPeak AT3Ws, 3" SL with a 3/4" leveling spacer up front. Rancho's. No BL, MM or SYE. Stock DS's. JKS adjustable CA's, JKS QD's. Front & Rear JKS track bars and HD Curry CorrectLync. 4.56's with TruckTrack LSDs, B&M short shift. BMB brakes. Aside from seats and slightly more aggressive tires (and a stroker), she is good as she is for a long time.

I drive it about 50-60 miles a day (60% of which is highway and bumper to bumper LI traffic) and camp out of it at least once a month. Zero issues with handling, comfort, performance (or lack there of); No vibrations, great highway manners, sharp steering. As good as my other, more modern Jeeps.

 

[GoldenGorilla]

An important thing to remember about a "3 inch lift" is that spring rates are constant* and that a 3" lift could easily net between 2.5" and 3.5" depending on the sprung weight of your jeep and the design parameters of the mfg. The difference between a 2.4L with a soft top and a 4.0L with a hard top is probably 200lbs or so. With TJ spring rates typically around 160lbs/in you can easily see where a difference will show up. It would make it easier for us if they'd all just say - we use this spring rate and the coil is this long. It's not as if it's a difficult thing to test.

Think aftermarket skids, even aluminum and you can easily see why there is a wild range of results. Some companies like Rock Jock/Currie and Metalcloak even say - this spring is intended for X" of lift for a Jeep with a full compliment of skids and armor. If you run light as I do, their 3.5" might be easily be a 4.5" lift.

JKS also offer a 3" spring

You could alternatively order a 2.5" spring and .75" spring spacer (aka leveling spacer" from several sources and end up functionally the same.

Ideally you want to install the spring, measure the shock length with the jeep on the ground and then order the correct length shock. But this isn't always practical. With a 3" lift you'll be safe ordering a shock for a 2.5" lift. It may be slightly limiting on drop, but be safe for uptravel.

*caveat - dual rate springs have 2 rates and are generally designed so that the lighter rate section will bind early in the travel if not at rest and the math is slightly different.

 

[MikekiM]

Curious... Are the spring rates for the LJ the same as for the TJ? Rubi rates higher?
I asked because back in my JK days I retro fit springs from a JKU to my very lean soft top only JK and netted 2" of lift with stock components.

 

[GoldenGorilla]

I'd always heard that there were a few different part numbers for springs with different setups back in the day, but never chased that down. I would think they had to have slightly different spring rates to land at the same ride height, but I suppose they could be on the same rate and wound and cut slightly different. The LJ definitely has a different rear spring than the TJ.

 

[mtg]

https://bds-suspension.com/products/2-inch-lift-kit-jeep-wrangler-tj-lj-97-06?variant=52389135843699

Pretty sure I’m settled on these shocks and springs. ^^ I know the Fox vs. Rancho debate is hot on this forum, but after looking at the most recent posts concerning Ranchos build quality (which looks terrible) I’ll just pay extra for the Fox much to chagrin of our veteran forum members haha.

This, along with an adjustable front track bar and rear track bar relocation bracket, should suffice for my needs and 33s

You all have successfully talked me out of a 3 inch suspension lift lol I do not want to deal with SYE or new control arms and all the other things a 3” suspension lift brings with it.

I’m not yet convinced on the BL though. And it’s purely for cosmetic reasons. I know I’ll get shit for running 33s on only two inches of lift BUT (1) the terrain in FL is simply not that demanding and (2) I will be adding barricade flat fenders for extra clearance.

If the 2” is not enough for my needs, then I will certainly add the BL down the road.

Okay. I’m ready. Proceed to tell me this is a terrible idea lol.

 

[DavidBT]

This is one of the best forums on the interwebs. They all just want to lead you in the right direction. The link you posted looks like it will be a great fit for you, considering how you plan to use your jeep.

 

[mtg]

This is one of the best forums on the interwebs. They all just want to lead you in the right direction. The link you posted looks like it will be a great fit for you, considering how you plan to use your jeep.

I’ve only been browsing this forum for a week and I completely agree. The folks on here are fantastic.

 

[thedustyboot]

@mtg My 2 cents about the shock options from BDS, the Fox shocks were a noticeable improvement over the BDS NX2 shocks that originally came with the kit having just done the BDS 4" long arm lift this summer

 

[DogDoc]

With a 3" lift you will likely need the SYE and a new driveshaft.

While some body lifts do indeed look tacky, the 1.25" from BMB looks right and is barely noticeable.

I'm running the BMB body lift and 2.5" springs to clear 33" tires (285/70/17).

I initially tried 3" springs but got driveshaft vibrations.

So what caused vibration? Pinionangle wrong?

 

[NashvilleTJ]

...

Also, now that I've been looking at 2.5" suspension and 1.25" BL as you suggested, I see a lot of people running 35s on this set up.

The reason I bring up 35s is because I really want to run flat fenders like this on my TJ because I absolutely love that look. However, I worry that 33s will look far too small with those fenders. Thoughts?

No one who knows anything about properly setting up a TJ is running that setup with 35s.

Also - keep reading and doing your research here. Running 35s is another whole can of worms compared to 33s. Brakes, gearing, axle upgrades / replacement, etc.

Give me a yell when you start thinking 'bout Tonz and Fodeez.

Welcome to the forum. Lots of good folks here who can help you out.

Jeff

 

[MtPockets]

Give me a yell when you start thing 'bout Tonz and Fodeez.

It's kind of a progressive disease, aint it???