Novak Conversions Jeep Wrangler TJ engine mounts

How Stellantis Destroyed Jeep (YouTube Video)

And in order to get the price of the vehicle down to an acceptable level for which people would consider purchasing they need to make large compromises on the quality and sourcing of drivetrain components.

The vast majority of folks want a disposable car. 100k no service and throw it away and get another.

We can moan all we want about the state of the industry but as long as the money votes in a completely different direction then we're going to continue to get vehicles that prioritize cup holder placement over transmission longevity. Because that's what sells.

Stellantis is in trouble because the vast majority of consumers don't want Jeeps.

The JK was popular because it was a small SUV and you could put a kid in a rear seat carrier without bending over.

Now you've got crossover SUVs that do the same thing, better cup holders, gas mileage and price.

Unless you have another Clueless movie that makes consumers fall in love all over again their isn't enough Jeep enthusiasts to save the brand.

-Mac

After spending lots of time in my friends JLUR 4XE, he and I both came to the conclusion that it's really a jack of all trades but master of none. On one hand it got reasonable mileage with the 4XE, it was quiet, it had two rows, and it had enough power. It was also pretty capable off-road in stock form. On the other hand, it was problematic as hell (always in the shop), too small to be a really good family car (he's got three kids and that back seat just isn't very big), not particularly as comfortable to drive as something with IFS, etc. In addition, they're far overpriced for what they are.

To your point though, most people who would have purchased a Wrangler are realizing there are better options out there that do it a lot better than the Wrangler.

It would be cool if Jeep wanted to compete with Mahindra (or similar) and start making bare bones 2-door models with the avid off-roader in mind again. Sure, it isn't a huge market compared to SUVs and crossovers, but the fanbase is there.
 
It would be cool if Jeep wanted to compete with Mahindra (or similar) and start making bare bones 2-door models with the avid off-roader in mind again. Sure, it isn't a huge market compared to SUVs and crossovers, but the fanbase is there.

Go after the side by side market.

Betcha plenty of people would consider a Jeep branded one.

-Mac
 
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Go after the side by side market.

Betcha plenty of people would consider a Jeep branded one.

-Mac

My thoughts exactly. I've felt this way for a while now. When I look at the money people shell out for a SxS (some of them are upwards of 50k now) I think to myself that if I were in charge of Jeep I would target that market with a barebones 2-door (CJ or TJ inspired) Wrangler.

Mahindra already has one, but the Jeep name carries a lot more weight, especially in the off-road world. I'm almost certain it would be a success as long as they could come in at a certain price point. Then they could make all their money off of selling factory upgrades and accessories. Seems like a real no-brainer.
 
barebones 2-door (CJ or TJ inspired) Wrangler.

Folks aren't buying 2 door stripper Jeeps or side by sides.

They want the four door loaded to the gills AC, stereo... everything.

Pisses me off that my closest Oregon OHV park is closed to "full sized" vehicles and open to side by sides. Arguably my TJ is smaller than most of the side by sides.

-Mac
 
Folks aren't buying 2 door stripper Jeeps or side by sides.

They want the four door loaded to the gills AC, stereo... everything.

Pisses me off that my closest Oregon OHV park is closed to "full sized" vehicles and open to side by sides. Arguably my TJ is smaller than most of the side by sides.

-Mac

Ahh, I guess that's the reason that whenever I take my RZR out I'm the only person around with a 2-seater. Everyone else has a 4-door!

Damn, everyone just wants bigger, bigger, bigger.

I've seen those Polaris Expeditions. 50k plus for a SxS! No thank you!
 
I never knew TJ's were that expensive. I would never pay 30k for a stock TJ, even if it was brand new.

My 2003 with a 2.4 and a 5 speed was $17,500ish MSRP including the Smoker's Group (two plugs for CB AND GMRS) and the other one or two options. That's $30,000ish today. No way in hell would I have paid $30,000 worth (today) back then for as something that was that sluggish. $4-5000 though 20 years later? Shit...
 
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That's OK - most people have a certain single point failure in their pocket. If it dies, goes flat, gets dropped, or is stolen; they're up the proverbial creek without the proverbial paddle!

I saw something on Facebook yesterday about someone having to borrow a phone charger at a dealership as her phone died, and was also unfortunately the only way she could access her electric car. One step forward, and somehow two steps back.
 
Ahh, I guess that's the reason that whenever I take my RZR out I'm the only person around with a 2-seater. Everyone else has a 4-door!

Damn, everyone just wants bigger, bigger, bigger.

I've seen those Polaris Expeditions. 50k plus for a SxS! No thank you!

Americans are tragically effete, and have more credit than brains. "Smartphone" is exhibit A1 of this.
 
The vast majority of folks want a disposable car. 100k no service and throw it away and get another.
This is the core problem right here. Although the throw away society has been with us for decades, it became far worse with the advent of the smartphone where such behavior was encouraged by the TelCos - the robber barons of our day. I'm to the point now of buying old/used things that were built to last, and refurbing them as needed. I did a 1960s table top fan that came out great as a for instance.
 
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I hate having to fix vehicles because they're 30 years old, but fixing analog sensors with a 10 dollar multimeter wins over $5000 scan tools any day.

I hear you. I'm not particularly interested in fixing vehicles, but I'm even less interested in the cost and PITA factor of the new ones!
 
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This is the core problem right here. Although the throw away society has been with us for decades, it became far worse with the advent of the smartphone where such behavior was encouraged by the TelCos - the robber barons of our day. I'm to the point now of buying old/used things that were built to last, and refurbing them as needed. I did a 1960s table top fan that came out great as a for instance.

I'm there too for the most part. I find myself more-and-more often refusing to buy it unless it's "vintage" or something that was built to last.
 
I hear you. I'm not particularly interested in fixing vehicles, but I'm even less interested in the cost and PITA factor of the new ones!

I had lost all my interest in working on vehicles (which is a shame because growing up all we ever used to do was work on cars) until I got that K10 Chevy. These newer vehicles just sucked the life out of me when it came to trying to work on them myself. That old Chevy is just so damn simple with so much room to work and maneuver. It's nice to own a vehicle where you know that if it breaks, you can fix it. That's peace of mind!
 
Case in point...4 doors...

IMG_20251118_144709.jpg


-Mac
 
A lot of families can only afford 1 vehicle, or 1 for each parent. So they buy 4 door Jeeps because they still want a Jeep but it has to do family duty as well. Same with trucks, they want a truck but they have to buy a big crew cab for the family. I've bucked the trend all my life, I've always had trucks and 4x4s but they were never my DD.
A lot of us here have our 2 door Jeeps just for toys and our dailies are something else. This was me till very recently. Now my Superduty is gone, my TDI DD is gone and for the first time in my life I own a 1/2 ton crew cab 4x4 truck that is my DD.
Still have the Jeep of course and it's still a toy.
 
Novak Conversions Jeep Wrangler TJ engine mounts