Track bars wearing mounts

[jws4621]

I am a guide at my local offroad park so my jeep gets lots of use. I am currently redoing the lift and such on my jeep got all that figured out but I was talking to some of my friends about track bars. They were saying that after drilling out for the bigger hardware on some brand of track bar the hardware loosened and wore out the hole on the frame mount side on the front. Is this a common issue?

I am currently thinking of using curry/rockjok front and rear track bars but they also require drilling the mounts on either side for the hardware. Is there something that will support the upper track bar mount better?

Thanks in advance for any advice I receive.

 

[jjvw]

Bolts loosen because they aren't properly torqued. Nothing more, nothing less.

In some cases, the front frame side bolt doesn't get fully seated in the recess on the top side of the mount. Then it can come loose. Currie/RockJock comes with a thick washer to prevent this. Beyond that, tighten the bolts and they will not come loose.

 

[freedom_in_4low]

The torque spec on that bolt is something like 130lbs if I remember correctly. If you torque it like the stock one (60ish) then it's going to come loose.

I wonder how in tune someone can be with their rig and not notice something like that. My second TJ had a worn joint that had less movement in it than a loose bolt would have and the steering response was terrifying. My last trip to Colorado I could feel (but not hear) a mild clunk in the rear end that turned out to be a loose lower control arm bolt.

 

[jws4621]

The torque spec on that bolt is something like 130lbs if I remember correctly. If you torque it like the stock one (60ish) then it's going to come loose.

I wonder how in tune someone can be with their rig and not notice something like that. My second TJ had a worn joint that had less movement in it than a loose bolt would have and the steering response was terrifying. My last trip to Colorado I could feel (but not hear) a mild clunk in the rear end that turned out to be a loose lower control arm bolt.

I wondered the same thing. I have only wheeled with the guy a few times. He seems in tune with his jeep but who is to know on that. Maybe it doesn't make noise until it is too late.

 

[Mike_H]

Too often, stuff like clunks and rattles fall into the category of, "it's a Jeep thing..." And people just ignore it.

I test drove one that was not right... The rear axle seemed to be working independent of the front and it had terrible bump steer. When I asked the lady, she said she noticed it, and took it to her mechanic. He said, "it's a Jeep, they are all like that."

I walked away shortly after that...

 

[freedom_in_4low]

Too often, stuff like clunks and rattles fall into the category of, "it's a Jeep thing..." And people just ignore it.

I test drove one that was not right... The rear axle seemed to be working independent of the front and it had terrible bump steer. When I asked the lady, she said she noticed it, and took it to her mechanic. He said, "it's a Jeep, they are all like that."

I walked away shortly after that...

From responses I see on the FB groups I wonder if 90% of TJs are owned with that attitude. When it comes to noises, behavior and appearance I expect factory except where I've done something to improve it, and I'm not accepting of sacrifice where it can be helped.

 

[mrblaine]

I am a guide at my local offroad park so my jeep gets lots of use. I am currently redoing the lift and such on my jeep got all that figured out but I was talking to some of my friends about track bars. They were saying that after drilling out for the bigger hardware on some brand of track bar the hardware loosened and wore out the hole on the frame mount side on the front. Is this a common issue?

I am currently thinking of using curry/rockjok front and rear track bars but they also require drilling the mounts on either side for the hardware. Is there something that will support the upper track bar mount better?

Thanks in advance for any advice I receive.

Your friends don't know much about bolts, bolted connections and how mechanical shit works. In design, any fastener in a connection that struggles to perform in an acceptable manner is almost never due to it being oversized, ever. The way the issue is resolved almost always is to move up in fastener size so it can be torqued to a higher level to create more clamping force to stabilize the connection.

If there was an issue with their rigs and installing something that later failed, it is about 99% likelihood of being installer error. They are wrong in their assessment of the issue and just as wrong in how they do their work.

 

[Mike_H]

From responses I see on the FB groups I wonder if 90% of TJs are owned with that attitude. When it comes to noises, behavior and appearance I expect factory except where I've done something to improve it, and I'm not accepting of sacrifice where it can be helped.

I'm with you... I'm very sensitive to clunks, rattles, vibrations, etc. My friends think I'm nuts... But to me, driving down the road nicely is as important as being a capable wheelin rig.

 

[mrblaine]

I'm with you... I'm very sensitive to clunks, rattles, vibrations, etc. My friends think I'm nuts... But to me, driving down the road nicely is as important as being a capable wheelin rig.

Everything you need and nothing you don't. That also applies to rattles, bumps, clunks, buzz, bang, click, and whistling noises.

 

[jws4621]

Actually as I was researching further after I posted this I agree. I am also very sensitive to new clunks and noises my jeep makes. I also didn't realize that most of these track bars come with a washer (correct word?) that fits in the tapered hole to make a smooth place for the fixture to tighten to.

 

[mrblaine]

Actually as I was researching further after I posted this I agree. I am also very sensitive to new clunks and noises my jeep makes. I also didn't realize that most of these track bars come with a washer (correct word?) that fits in the tapered hole to make a smooth place for the fixture to tighten to.

No, while some of them do come with a tapered sleeve with a straight hole in it for the smaller 9/16" bolt, that is a wholly unnecessary expense since it does exactly zero to stabilize the connection. The connection is stabilized and rendered viable purely though the clamping force and bolt stretch when it is torqued properly. At that point the bolt is not moving in the hole, the joint is not able to be moved against the mount and the trackbar can do its job.

Anyone that sends, sells, or uses the sleeve in that application is just ignorant of how that connection works and is wasting money and time making and supplying it.

The other part is with the 5/8" bolts alluded to previous, there is a thick washer that HAS to fit down into the counterbore or spotface on the top side of the mount rather than on the uneven forged surface of the mount. When it sits on top, then forces from the trackbar cause it to get movement because the bolt stretch is being lost as the washer mashes down the uneven high spots. Get the washer down into the counterbore, torque it correct, it will never come loose.