Jeep guns

[Tray Burge]

I'm currently building a pistol AR and am curious how you like the 7" barrel? I've read some how didn't and others who said it was fine. And of course WA is one of those LIBERAL states where I can't buy that Binary trigger at.

As a range toy, the 556/223 in 7.5 barrel is a blast to shoot, unfortunately, it can't be suppressed enough to make it a safe indoor home defense weapon. However, the same gun in 300 black out can be silenced down to a "whisper" and while being too expensive to shoot for a range toy makes the perfect home defense pistol. My next one will be in 300 BO with the Binary trigger for this reason. I like the idea of having a 50rnd drum for home protection, home invasions happen with 3 or more guys invading.

 

[Sundowner]

As an instructor that teaches people about this kind of thing, I have some disagreements, here...

As a range toy, the 556/223 in 7.5 barrel is a blast to shoot, unfortunately, it can't be suppressed enough to make it a safe indoor home defense weapon.

"Suppression" isn't the main problem with a 5.56 in a 7.5" AR barrel, indoors or out. The issues are problematic cycling in that short of a barrel, impairing muzzle blast, and - inside, at least - a high danger of over-penetration despite the shortness of the barrel. There's also the physical size of the platform to contend with; even a short AR gets unwieldy in a hallway... especially if you have to shoot across it instead of down the length.

However, the same gun in 300 black out can be silenced down to a "whisper" and while being too expensive to shoot for a range toy makes the perfect home defense pistol.

Suppression, again, isn't the main issue. Those with enough training to shoot an SMG in close quarters might be able to make use of something like this, but for most people, that's not the case in a home invasion: adrenaline, panic and disorientation make the AR a more difficult platform than most other options, for the aforementioned reasons. Also, you're still dealing with a high-velocity rifle round: .300 AAC can hit 2,100 FPS, even in short barrels. I've seen numbers as high as 2,300; I don't know about you, but that's way higher than I'm comfortable with, inside. Also, "perfect" is very subjective...but it's usually whatever someone shoots best, has on-hand, and which is most likely to put lead on target with no accidents or difficulties...and for most people, that's either 1) a striker-fired pistol, 2) a revolver, or 3) a shotgun. I prefer the latter; I steer most people to the second.

My next one will be in 300 BO with the Binary trigger for this reason. I like the idea of having a 50rnd drum for home protection, home invasions happen with 3 or more guys invading.

I would consider that to be a cumbersome combination for the purpose, but if you can handle it: go for it. I have an XM177 that'll eat anything you feed it, and I know I wouldn't want to deal with that gun inside; same goes for the .300 AAC, and the 9mm blowback. Of all of them, I'd take the 9mm, but I still don't like a gun that large inside.

 

[Tray Burge]

And that's why I practice, practice, practice. The best gun is the one you shoot best, period.

 

[Wildman]

Thanks for all the input. I've been toying with a 10" or longer barrel. Also thought about doing a 9mm conversion but I think if I was to go 9mm I'd just get a lower made for it.

300 Blackout is an option but I have never shot it yet. I've been playing with M16's since 1978 and have a lot of range time with it, M4 & M60 and M240B and M249. But I only got my first AR 7 years ago. Took me a while after getting shot in Iraq to want to shot again.

 

[Tray Burge]

300 BO suppressed will make a very nice home defense gun. Next!

 

[Sundowner]

Thanks for all the input. I've been toying with a 10" or longer barrel. Also thought about doing a 9mm conversion but I think if I was to go 9mm I'd just get a lower made for it.

10's, 10.5's, 11's...in my experience they're almost always finicky, and absolutely brutal for sustained firing.

9mm: go with a dedicated lower that takes the Colt SMG mags.

300 Blackout is an option but I have never shot it yet. I've been playing with M16's since 1978 and have a lot of range time with it, M4 & M60 and M240B and M249. But I only got my first AR 7 years ago. Took me a while after getting shot in Iraq to want to shot again.

Pricey round, for what it is...and to be perfectly honest, I haven't found a lot of use for it other than to simply have it and play with it (because this is America, damn it!) It's nice to have a .30-ish round in the AR platform, but there are other options for that. Most of the hype on the Blackout is from people that really want to like it.

Thanks for your service.

 

[Sundowner]

300 BO suppressed will make a very nice home defense gun. Next!

Explain, please?

 

[Wildman]

10's, 10.5's, 11's...in my experience they're almost always finicky, and absolutely brutal for sustained firing.

9mm: go with a dedicated lower that takes the Colt SMG mags.

Thanks that is pretty much what I have been looking at using for the 9mm. As for the short barrel after all the reading I have done I am thinking I might go with a 13" barrel. I'm not sure now why I bought this kit.

Pricey round, for what it is...and to be perfectly honest, I haven't found a lot of use for it other than to simply have it and play with it (because this is America, damn it!) It's nice to have a .30-ish round in the AR platform, but there are other options for that. Most of the hype on the Blackout is from people that really want to like it.

Thanks for your service.

Yes I know it isn't cheap which is one reason why I haven't chambered anything in it yet. They were still testing it when I was discharged so it wasn't being used in the SpecOPs yet. So I never got to play on the governments dime.

Thanks

 

[Tray Burge]

Explain, please?

300 BO was designed to be suppressed, that's why they call it the "Whisper" round when suppressed. Can be shot in a 7.5 barrel without any hearing protection, literally a whisper.
That's why.

 

[Sundowner]

300 BO was designed to be suppressed, that's why they call it the "Whisper" round when suppressed. Can be shot in a 7.5 barrel without any hearing protection, literally a whisper.
That's why.

That tells me what I need to know; thank you.

 

[Viking Jeeper]

Between the jeep and the guns I never have to worry about any coin in my pockets.

I'm with you....

 

[Viking Jeeper]

...but it's usually whatever someone shoots best, has on-hand, and which is most likely to put lead on target with no accidents or difficulties...and for most people, that's either 1) a striker-fired pistol, 2) a revolver, or 3) a shotgun. I prefer the latter; I steer most people to the second.

For me thats a SBR AR in 300 BLK with suppressor or my MPX pistol. I compete with the AR platform and much prefer that for home defense. If someone is not proficient enough to run other types of weapons they probably have no business being behind a DA revolver either. Single shot shotgun, bolt action rifle, Glock, revolver, pump shotgun, double barrel shotgun, SBR, legal full auto, on and on and on. None of them are any good in the hands of a novice.

 

[Sundowner]

I compete with the AR platform and much prefer that for home defense.

What kind of competition do you do?

 

[Boinked]

Over the years i have thought about what is the best home defense weapon. I still stand by my empty 12 gauge pump shotgun.

Unless the intruder is deaf. The first pump will send most people running for the door. For the idiot that doesn't run. I have my loaded 1911. With Glaser Safety Slug. (Dont want to worry about hurting people outside the house).

The best defense is not to have to shoot.

 

[Sundowner]

Over the years i have thought about what is the best home defense weapon. I still stand by my empty 12 gauge pump shotgun.

Unless the intruder is deaf. The first pump will send most people running for the door. For the idiot that doesn't run. I have my loaded 1911. With Glaser Safety Slug. (Dont want to worry about hurting people outside the house).

But...why switch guns?

 

[BugoutJeep]

Practice is also a lot of fun and not just from a bench. I'm a fan of the SBR/Pistol ARs 300 BLK or 5.56. I like to keep the 300 BLK for suppressed stuff. My go to is the Tavor in 5.56 with 16" barrel it's still the length of most Pistol ARs with an extended stock. Works great in and out of vehicles and stores nicely in the top of the Jeep, even when suppressed. It fits in some various bags and boxes as well so it's not so obvious what you're carrying.

I like 5.56 for coyotes and varmints and if stepping out to talk with trespassers and poachers ARs/Tavors seems to add some extra politeness to the offender(s). Often poachers will have rifles so I don't like to carry only a pistol or shotgun and I don't get to choose how a criminal reacts. At various times I've tried to commit to only 1 rifle, but after deer hunting a few times with the 5.56 I just liked how larger calibers perform, may try a 300 BLK with 16in barrel for thick woods hunting.

As far as CQB, I just feel and handle a rifle better and really prefer the Tavor for that type of movement as well. I like how the controls on the Tavor are laid out on the rifle as well. AR has some great work around devices, but I always hated the charging handle, but there's plenty of stuff that's great too, especially the prices lately. A rifle strapped to you can be used pretty effectively in hand to hand as well, though I would consider that a screw up on my part. I don't have kids, so I'm not very worried about pass throughs and consider them a tool if necessary.

 

[Viking Jeeper]

What kind of competition do you do?

2 Gun. Never had the desire to add the shotgun into the mix.

 

[Viking Jeeper]

2 Gun. Never had the desire to add the shotgun into the mix.

I also have an AR platform rifle in 9MM that I use for Steel Challenge but there is no reloading under time stress in that sport so it falls short of being enough practice to help in real world scenarios.

 

[Boinked]

But...why switch guns?

Long guns are not good around doors and through hallways. My 12 gauge is a bird gun (only used for hunting) just can't justify a home shotgun.

 

[Sundowner]

Long guns are not good around doors and through hallways. My 12 gauge is a bird gun (only used for hunting) just can't justify a home shotgun.

I'm not a fan of deterrence; if someone comes into my house for ill intent and they know I'm there, it's likely about to be a BAD situation...so that's Game On. If they don't know I'm there, it's likely that they were looking for an easy score to get some cash, and that's a different story entirely.

That said: I don't like a long gun inside, either. I have a business-length shotgun and I'm proficient with it, but most people aren't. I'm not a fan of ARs inside, either...or any rifle caliber: I have my pick, and I don't rely on any of them indoors. Same goes for the SMGs.