A/C failure after heater core repair

[freedom_in_4low]

And it’s standard practice to do so? It seems like a $30 part.


so from your perspective not doing so is a bit negligent and could have caused my compressor to seize?

The accumulator (which serves to collect and boil off any refrigerant that remains in a liquid state coming out of the evaporator before it goes to the compressor) also functions as a drier, which consists of a desiccant material which absorbs moisture in the system. Sequestering moisture in the system is good because the chemicals comprising the oil and refrigerant react poorly to water, leading to the formation of other unwelcome substances, like acids that can corrode internal components.

The desiccant has a limited capacity, so when the system has been opened and the desiccant exposed to atmospheric humidity, it becomes saturated and no longer functions. Therefore it should be replaced as the last step before closing up and evacuating the system.

 

[DuckNut]

What does a locking compressor sound like? The sound was squealing while the AC was turned on. When turned off it went away. Then quit completely when it just blew hot air.

Jkp answered this below.

 

[NskLJ]

Opening the system without replacing the accumulator is not good.

It was the manufacturer procedure for the last 20 years. They stated pumping it down properly would remove the moisture from the accumulator. Now if this was just a cost saving measure where they just rolled the dice I am not sure.

 

[NskLJ]

Not sure what to look at. It seems good. One thing I noticed is the workmanship may be a little sloppy? The fresh air vent is just hanging there. See photo.

View attachment 541635

View attachment 541636

The service ports are circled if you remove them see if you see some leakage there or did they just forget to service it.

 

[TJ4Jim]

It was the manufacturer procedure for the last 20 years. They stated pumping it down properly would remove the moisture from the accumulator. Now if this was just a cost saving measure where they just rolled the dice I am not sure.

Not what Carrier taught us 40 plus ago, not worth the callback.

 

[NskLJ]

Not what Carrier taught us 40 plus ago, not worth the callback.

Like I said it could have been a dollar issue.The manufacturer I worked for change the procedure over 30 years ago. I have had zero failures doing small repairs and not replacing dryer as long as there was pressure in the system to start with. Any larger repairs definitely replace accumulator.

 

[Tami]

The accumulator (which serves to collect and boil off any refrigerant that remains in a liquid state coming out of the evaporator before it goes to the compressor) also functions as a drier, which consists of a desiccant material which absorbs moisture in the system. Sequestering moisture in the system is good because the chemicals comprising the oil and refrigerant react poorly to water, leading to the formation of other unwelcome substances, like acids that can corrode internal components.

The desiccant has a limited capacity, so when the system has been opened and the desiccant exposed to atmospheric humidity, it becomes saturated and no longer functions. Therefore it should be replaced as the last step before closing up and evacuating the system.

Thank you for that information. You sound very knowledgeable

 

[Tami]

The service ports are circled if you remove them see if you see some leakage there or did they just forget to service it.View attachment 541748

I believe they replaced the hoses along with the repairs and I brought it back when I realized my cooling system didn’t work well and honestly it hasn’t been the same since. It used to be ice cold and super hot. Now it’s mediocre heat an no cool

 

[freedom_in_4low]

Thank you for that information. You sound very knowledgeable

no worries.

I am an engineer with 17 years in commercial and industrial refrigeration and HVAC system design. I enjoy this place in the summer because all the AC threads pop up and I actually get to be the guy that helps people instead of the one always asking for help.

 

[JKP]

Sadly we are searching for an OEM equivalent heater core. Most of the aftermarket ones do not put out as much heat.

 

[NskLJ]

I believe they replaced the hoses along with the repairs and I brought it back when I realized my cooling system didn’t work well and honestly it hasn’t been the same since. It used to be ice cold and super hot. Now it’s mediocre heat an no cool.

I think you may be getting some of your terminology mixed up, I don’t know if this could be causing a communication issue when you take it back to the shop.
The cooling system refers to the radiator, water pump, hoses and heater core which purpose is to remove heat from the engine. The coolant also goes into the heater core o provide heat for the occupants.
The a/c system has a belt driven compressor, condenser, evaporator and hoses which is separate from the cooling system ( sound backwards ) the a/c system cools the passenger compartment.
The plenum or air distribution box under the dash contains the heater core and the a/c evaporator and movable doors to provide heat or cooling and air flow as selected.
As far as not getting enough heat, there could be air trapped in the heater core, a heater core that is not as efficient as the original or the door that changes from hot to cold air may not be moving fully into heat position.
The a/c you said it made a loud noise and shut off. Did it sound like air blowing out or was it a grinding type noise? I would take this back and have the shop look at it. They need to evacuate and recharge the system at minimum.

 

[Tami]

I think you may be getting some of your terminology mixed up, I don’t know if this could be causing a communication issue when you take it back to the shop.
The cooling system refers to the radiator, water pump, hoses and heater core which purpose is to remove heat from the engine. The coolant also goes into the heater core o provide heat for the occupants.
The a/c system has a belt driven compressor, condenser, evaporator and hoses which is separate from the cooling system ( sound backwards ) the a/c system cools the passenger compartment.
The plenum or air distribution box under the dash contains the heater core and the a/c evaporator and movable doors to provide heat or cooling and air flow as selected.
As far as not getting enough heat, there could be air trapped in the heater core, a heater core that is not as efficient as the original or the door that changes from hot to cold air may not be moving fully into heat position.
The a/c you said it made a loud noise and shut off. Did it sound like air blowing out or was it a grinding type noise? I would take this back and have the shop look at it. They need to evacuate and recharge the system at minimum.

Yes, it is the AC system not engine cooling system.
I sent the shop an email explaining what I learned could be the problem from here.
I saw him today and he told me initially that the only thing that the mechanic touched was some sort of valve that they found leaking the second time I brought it in complaining about how the AC was not cold like usual.
When I told him that the accumulator should have been replaced since the system was opened up he kind of poo pooed it saying that after a few times maybe but that in my repair they had plugged it to replace the heater core and that’s it.
I reminded him that they had replaced all of the AC hoses and should have replaced all of the o rings and the $16 accumulator.
Is this correct?
He said he would look at it.. saying, “well we definitely have a leak.”
So much more now. I suspect that the compressor is shot based on the noise and that no cold air at all came out after it stopped.
What do you think is fair considering that it looks like this damage/ issue is due to workmanship of a related part?

 

[macleanflood]

New hoses typically have new o rings.

Fair is they fix the problem they caused. Good luck with that.

Hopefully you paid with a credit card. You can always dispute the charges and report them to the Idaho Consumer Protection board.

-Mac

 

[NskLJ]

Yes, it is the AC system not engine cooling system.
I sent the shop an email explaining what I learned could be the problem from here.
I saw him today and he told me initially that the only thing that the mechanic touched was some sort of valve that they found leaking the second time I brought it in complaining about how the AC was not cold like usual.
When I told him that the accumulator should have been replaced since the system was opened up he kind of poo pooed it saying that after a few times maybe but that in my repair they had plugged it to replace the heater core and that’s it.
I reminded him that they had replaced all of the AC hoses and should have replaced all of the o rings and the $16 accumulator.
Is this correct?
He said he would look at it.. saying, “well we definitely have a leak.”
So much more now. I suspect that the compressor is shot based on the noise and that no cold air at all came out after it stopped.
What do you think is fair considering that it looks like this damage/ issue is due to workmanship of a related part?

The valve was probably the shrader valve these are the service ports under the caps where the gauges hook up. If he replace all the A/C hoses, the schrader valves are part of the hose. He should have put the Accumulator and the o rings in it. I don’t know why the A/c hoses were replaced if the A/C was functioning properly. I would think the coolant hoses were replaced. Is the compressor still making noise? If it made noise and went away it could have been some liquid refrigerant in the compressor. I would think he needs to diagnose the A/C system and discuss what it will take to get it back to the way it was. If you have a invoice and take a picture of the parts I can look at it and see what was actually replaced.

 

[kmac5130]

Sadly we are searching for an OEM equivalent heater core. Most of the aftermarket ones do not put out as much heat.

I first replaced mine with one from rockauto that seemed to have the best reviews (forget which brand). Anyway the heat was nowhere close to what it was with the factory heater core. After some research on the forums, I went with one from performance radiator. Had to call them to order it, but it wasn’t expensive. When I swapped it in, I once again had extreme heat. The factory heater core would burn my hand at the vents. This one from performance radiator comes very close to that if not the same. Also the cooling system was completely clean for both heater cores, so there was no reason that the first replacement would have been clogged. And I had both in for extended periods of time and burped the system, so air in the core was not the issue. Heater cores usually have a turbulator, which is a helical device in the inlet tube intended to mix up the flow. That way the hot coolant is more evenly distributed through the core as it passes through. Some people figured out that certain cores used thick plastic turbulators that significantly diminished the flow through the core. The performance radiator core uses a metal coil-spring type turbulator, however, which allows for plenty of flow through the core.

 

[freedom_in_4low]

Yes, it is the AC system not engine cooling system.
I sent the shop an email explaining what I learned could be the problem from here.
I saw him today and he told me initially that the only thing that the mechanic touched was some sort of valve that they found leaking the second time I brought it in complaining about how the AC was not cold like usual.
When I told him that the accumulator should have been replaced since the system was opened up he kind of poo pooed it saying that after a few times maybe but that in my repair they had plugged it to replace the heater core and that’s it.
I reminded him that they had replaced all of the AC hoses and should have replaced all of the o rings and the $16 accumulator.
Is this correct?
He said he would look at it.. saying, “well we definitely have a leak.”
So much more now. I suspect that the compressor is shot based on the noise and that no cold air at all came out after it stopped.
What do you think is fair considering that it looks like this damage/ issue is due to workmanship of a related part?

If they took measures to keep air out of the dryer then the need for replacing it is arguable. It's not single handedly going to cause the issues you're having anyway. I would expect them to do whatever is required to return the system to the same level of operation it had before they touched it.

 

[Deputy Dodge]

Commercial HVAC is not automotive AC. As a former dealer tech I've opened plenty of systems without replacing a drier unless changing other components. Plugging the lines while open and a proper evac are all that's needed even in high humidity. Ford engineers even poured a cup of water in a drier to see what would happen. Results were nothing happened.

 

[Tami]

The valve was probably the shrader valve these are the service ports under the caps where the gauges hook up. If he replace all the A/C hoses, the schrader valves are part of the hose. He should have put the Accumulator and the o rings in it. I don’t know why the A/c hoses were replaced if the A/C was functioning properly. I would think the coolant hoses were replaced. Is the compressor still making noise? If it made noise and went away it could have been some liquid refrigerant in the compressor. I would think he needs to diagnose the A/C system and discuss what it will take to get it back to the way it was. If you have a invoice and take a picture of the parts I can look at it and see what was actually replaced.

 

[NskLJ]

View attachment 544587

Tami. The shop did the heater core and the radiator hoses. They did not do any A/c hoses. The labor description is a little odd but that may of come from the labor guide. It should read Remove and Replace Heater core on vehicle equipped with factory A/c, Replace Radiator hoses.
Bring it back to the shop and see what they can do to get it fixed. If it was working before they should get it back to the way it was. If the schrader valves are leaking they may want you to buy the parts (around $30 ) the valves are notorious for leaking after attaching service gauges. I would get with the manager and explain the situation and try to get them to rectify it.

 

[Tami]

Yes, it is the AC system not engine cooling system.
I sent the shop an email explaining what I learned could be the problem from here.
I saw him today and he told me initially that the only thing that the mechanic touched was some sort of valve that they found leaking the second time I brought it in complaining about how the AC was not cold like usual.
When I told him that the accumulator should have been replaced since the system was opened up he kind of poo pooed it saying that after a few times maybe but that in my repair they had plugged it to replace the heater core and that’s it.
I reminded him that they had replaced all of the AC hoses and should have replaced all of the o rings and the $16 accumulator.
Is this correct?
He said he would look at it.. saying, “well we definitely have a leak.”
So much more now. I suspect that the compressor is shot based on the noise and that no cold air at all came out after it stopped.
What do you think is fair considering that it looks like this damage/ issue is due to workmanship of a related parts

Tami. The shop did the heater core and the radiator hoses. They did not do any A/c hoses. The labor description is a little odd but that may of come from the labor guide. It should read Remove and Replace Heater core on vehicle equipped with factory A/c, Replace Radiator hoses.
Bring it back to the shop and see what they can do to get it fixed. If it was working before they should get it back to the way it was. If the schrader valves are leaking they may want you to buy the parts (around $30 ) the valves are notorious for leaking after attaching service gauges. I would get with the manager and explain the situation and try to get them to rectify it.

Update on A/C: need help in responding.
The shop just left me a message saying that my compressor melted and clutch seized or something. What I need to know from experts here on this thread is if this is something totally separate or a result from condensation or some thing from a leak in the system left over from the Heater core repair. Like I said, my air conditioner never worked appropriately after the heater core repair but before that was very amazing I had brought it in after the repair to report that it was not working and they apparently found the Schrader valve was open and apparently fixed that And charged up my system.
Is there anyone on this thread that would be willing to let me know if this is something that could result from poor workmanship on the heater core.