Complain about your daily driver

[freedom_in_4low]

I really still don't see the point of FWD - I've always thought that it was a cheap way to get "decent" handling that would take more money to achieve with a RWD. Is my thinking flawed?

There is the slight benefit of understeer instead of oversteer for people that can't drive in snow, but otherwise it's 100% about cost. Get rid of a driveshaft, then once the rear suspension doesn't have to transmit drive torque, it can be made out of toothpicks, while integrating the differential into the transmission housing saves further cost vs separate boxes.

To me there is zero benefit and any FWD vehicle to me never surpasses being thought of as an appliance.

 

[ColoJeep]

That’s interesting, I’ve never seen a FWD engine mounted inline. Usually they’re transverse.

Here are some photos of the Toronado drive train. They worked well .

 

[Apparition]

I really still don't see the point of FWD - I've always thought that it was a cheap way to get "decent" handling that would take more money to achieve with a RWD. Is my thinking flawed?

I've never driven a FWD car that didn't suck. But, as Rasband said people don't have to worry about their back end trying to pass them in slick conditions. AWD FTW.

FWD function like this.

 

[ColoJeep]

I really still don't see the point of FWD - I've always thought that it was a cheap way to get "decent" handling that would take more money to achieve with a RWD. Is my thinking flawed?

It has advantages , mostly cheaper to build and package . The wild thing about the Toronado is the interior , without a transmission tunnel it was like sitting in your living room , of course it understeered like your living room too . The throttle is your friend. The only FWD car I liked the handling of was our 2002 Golf ,
It was amazing , it liked to be pushed hard , of course the tires didn't like it and it had VW reliability so there is that .

 

[MaximusLJR06]

It doesn’t really matter to me because I don’t live there and it isn’t my problem, but I think my consulting services are over, lol. I wanted him to get a GX460 which would actually maintain resale value and not be a complete turd. The enclave retains no value because nobody is looking for them, and they’re pieces of crap. Oh well….

My daily up until December of 2024 was a 02 Acura RSX that never had any major problems (had to replace the vtec solenoid and 1 O2 sensor). Bought it in 2017 with 80K on it and sold it in Jan 2025 with 120K on it. Bought for $6K and sold for $7.5K. Great vehicle, would have kept it but already have too many cars. But December 24 I picked up a CPO 23 GX460, had been looking at them for about a year and came to the conclusion it is probably one of the most reliable vehicles available these days. Hope that holds true for the long run, plan on having it for 10-15 years.

 

[BlueC]

Sounds like someone needs a square body Suburban ...

Have you seen the prices on a clean one lately? What used to be a $2,500 truck not very long ago is now $25,000.

 

[BlueC]

Where's the transmission? Looks like it would be underneath the car in a tunnel like a RWD vehicle.

It's a Turbo 425, a modified 400, it looks like this.

 

[MaximusLJR06]

Have you seen the prices on a clean one lately? What used to be a $2,500 truck not very long ago is now $25,000.

Prices on everything are stupid anymore, especially cars and housing.

 

[ColoJeep]

Have you seen the prices on a clean one lately? What used to be a $2,500 truck not very long ago is now $25,000.

So about the same cost as a crap pile Nissan minivan .

 

[BlueC]

So about the same cost as a crap pile Nissan minivan .

It's hard to get passed the cost multiplier from the last few years, but that really is how you have to think about it if you're looking to make a driver out of one.

 

[ColoJeep]

It's hard to get passed the cost multiplier from the last few years, but that really is how you have to think about it if you're looking to make a driver out of one.

Our most expensive square body was a 1980 K - 20 that was 12 years old , I had to give $ 5000.00 . Most of them were around 3 - 3500 .
Of course now an ATV cost 6 - 7 K. And Suburbans cost 65 - 85 K . If you really want to freak out , we could talk about Colorado mountain homes .
The cost multiplier has gone crazy the passed 10 years . I guess people will pay a lot of money not to live in another state !

 

[rasband]

I've never driven a FWD car that didn't suck.

100% this.

 

[LukesfirstJeep]

Our most expensive square body was a 1980 K - 20 that was 12 years old , I had to give $ 5000.00 . Most of them were around 3 - 3500 .
Of course now an ATV cost 6 - 7 K. And Suburbans cost 65 - 85 K . If you really want to freak out , we could talk about Colorado mountain homes .
The cost multiplier has gone crazy the passed 10 years . I guess people will pay a lot of money not to live in another state !

I agree about cost multipliers. For ATV's, are you talking used? Honda Ranchers are $10K, and Polaris RZR Pro is $27K, per the internet.

 

[BlueC]

For ATV's, are you talking used?

There are still new full sized ATVs available for under $7K MSRP, including Hondas.

I have one of these for yard work and riding the kids around.

 

[jeepguy03]

New ATVs are not worth the prices they are asking either. Over complicated POS. Sure, they are more powerful and comfortable than ever before, but I absolutely refuse to work on any modern ones. Had a family member with a newer fuel injected Arctic Cat. Super nice machine, but after an hour of riding it would just randomly quit, some kind of electrical glitch, and he would be stranded. You aren't going to push something that heavy when you are in the middle of the trail. He took it to 3 or 4 different dealers before they found the issue, some wiring problem, after hours of diagnostic labor.

I'll take my 1995 Honda Fourtrax 300 4x4 any day.

So about the same cost as a crap pile Nissan minivan .

The difference is in 10 years the square body will still be on the road, and parts for the Nissan will be NLA.

 

[Apparition]

New ATVs are not worth the prices they are asking either. Over complicated POS. Sure, they are more powerful and comfortable than ever before, but I absolutely refuse to work on any modern ones. Had a family member with a newer fuel injected Arctic Cat. Super nice machine, but after an hour of riding it would just randomly quit, some kind of electrical glitch, and he would be stranded. You aren't going to push something that heavy when you are in the middle of the trail. He took it to 3 or 4 different dealers before they found the issue, some wiring problem, after hours of diagnostic labor.

I'll take my 1995 Honda Fourtrax 300 4x4 any day.

Needs less 4x

My stable has one of these

And one of these

 

[BlueC]

My stable has one of these

One of my cousins has an all blue Banshee with a "big jug" kit, I think it's a 450 now. She's quick, and quite peaky. That's the only machine that I've been able to run over myself while still riding it. I slipped with my left leg and and went under the back tire for a second. I had a burnout style black mark on my calf for a week.

 

[lBasket]

New ATVs are not worth the prices they are asking either. Over complicated POS. Sure, they are more powerful and comfortable than ever before, but I absolutely refuse to work on any modern ones. Had a family member with a newer fuel injected Arctic Cat. Super nice machine, but after an hour of riding it would just randomly quit, some kind of electrical glitch, and he would be stranded. You aren't going to push something that heavy when you are in the middle of the trail. He took it to 3 or 4 different dealers before they found the issue, some wiring problem, after hours of diagnostic labor.

I'll take my 1995 Honda Fourtrax 300 4x4 any day.



The difference is in 10 years the square body will still be on the road, and parts for the Nissan will be NLA.

Nissan is terrible for older parts availability IME. It was an absolute nightmare keeping my 92 pathfinder running.

 

[jeepguy03]

Needs less 4x

My stable has one of these
View attachment 635170

And one of these

View attachment 635171

Love both of those. I've owned a few Honda 400ex, one with a big bore, a little Yamaha Blaster, and a YZ250. There is nowhere legal in my area to ride now, and combined with a bad back, the slow 300 Fourtrax is perfect for just light trail riding and plowing the driveway now.

 

[BlueC]

There is nowhere legal in my area to ride now

That's the bad part about a 4-wheeler around here. Unless you have land or know someone who does, you really can't ride anywhere. SXS can be street legal here under 55 mph, so maybe ATVs have some room there now, or soon.