TJT - Installed 2024 JT control arms in my 04 TJ

[Rickstar321]

This experiment was a bug that Greg Henderson of Unofficial Use Only put in my brain during one of our Round Table discussions on the Jeep Talk Show... Greg is a super great knowledgeable guy. When he worked for AEV he built a lot of the Brutes you see running around today, and actually he just built two more Brute kits and delivering them to the customers this month.

What really kicked it off for me was in April 2025, I took a trip to Southern Utah from Northeast Arkansas in my TJ for a 2-week camping and wheeling adventure. After hundreds of miles on washboard gravel roads and bowling ball size rocks my control arm bushings were roached. Although I am very annal about maintenance I'm NOT easy on this Jeep so not really too surprised. I had 3 days left to wheel, and a 2,100-mile trip back home on roached bushings, which was unfortunate, but it would be difficult to get 3 different aftermarket company sets of bushings into Moab in time for it to matter. So that settled it for me, as soon as I got back home, time for the experiment.
My '04 TJ Specs:

• Original 4.0 I6
• AX15 with Hurst short throw (I swapped in cracked old 3550 housing)
• Flat belly tummy tuck - 1" Motor lift, 1-1/4" body lift, SYE, cable selector
• Rubi Dana 44's front and back.
• WJ Knuckle Swap with OTK custom made DOM Steering / front track bar relocation.
• 35" Nexen Roadian MTX
• Genright Crawler tank, highline fenders, rock rails.
• 2-1/2" OME Coils / Rancho 5000X shocks
• Skyjacker stock length lower control arms front and rear.
• Ironman 4x4 adjustable front upper
• Rubicon Express adjustable rear upper

and a lot more but not relevant to this thread.
What did I expect to gain from Gladiator control arms in a TJ?

• 25 year newer technology.
• Longer arms acting like a Mid Arm kit - Better geometry
• Ease of replacement no matter where I am.
• More durability since the TJ is WAY lighter than the JT (Gladiator).
• Better ride on the street
• Better performance off road
• the challenge of the fabrication
• and... because it's different.

Cost.. a couple hundred dollars in Barnes 4WD brackets and some hardware (nuts and bolts), and a little blood sweat and tears.
While I was in there... I also did a 3/4" front and a 5" rear stretch, so I'm sitting at 99" wheelbase now.

What did I gain?
My "seat of the pants" feel is like I'm riding on a suspension now instead of on the ends of pogo sticks... best way I can describe it.
On the road ride is dramatically better than before. Off road I feel way more planted, and I immediately noticed it walks up ledges way easier than before.
It was a lot of work, I complicated it A LOT by throwing in the 5" stretch, or it would have been really easy, but I am very happy with the results.
I'm very much a novice fabricator, and I learned A LOT during this process, and yes... I'd definitely do it again.

 

[Rickstar321]

Alignment: Once I had my new wheel base measurement, 99 inches, I found the center point (49-1/2") on my frame. Greg's instructions were to point each control arm to that point. I used a Harbor Freight level that you could lock (not auto level) magnetized to a jack stand. LIned up the bolts to point directly at as close to the same spot as I could get on the frame.

 

[TheBoogieman]

Nice. I'm happy it worked for you. You could've waited forever for Savvy and then be pissed they didn't include stickers.

 

[jjvw]

Alignment: Once I had my new wheel base measurement, 99 inches, I found the center point (49-1/2") on my frame. Greg's instructions were to point each control arm to that point. I used a Harbor Freight level that you could lock (not auto level) magnetized to a jack stand. LIned up the bolts to point directly at as close to the same spot as I could get on the frame.

View attachment 631265

View attachment 631266

What is the vertical separation at the axle and frame?

 

[Rickyd]

Did you do the upper arms?

 

[Rickstar321]

Did you do the upper arms?

yes, that was this pic's alignment, couldn't see the arm on the other side, but marked where to put it on the other side.

 

[Rickstar321]

What is the vertical separation at the axle and frame?

I know the formula "25% of the tire axle side, and half of that for the frame... but honestly, I just followed Greg's instructions, I left the axles at stock separation, and then sighted the CA's to the middle of the frame. It handles and feels way better than it ever has, haven't felt any dive or squat so I haven't even questioned it.

Sigh... now you're gonna make me have to go measure and see... lol..

 

[jjvw]

I know the formula "25% of the tire axle side, and half of that for the frame... but honestly, I just followed Greg's instructions, I left the axles at stock separation, and then sighted the CA's to the middle of the frame. It handles and feels way better than it ever has, haven't felt any dive or squat so I haven't even questioned it.

Sigh... now you're gonna make me have to go measure and see... lol..

Any numbers are more of an indicator. If the upper mounts are as high as a TJ with a small body lift allow or you cut into the body, that is an indicator. At the end of the day, all that really matters is if you corrected the fairly specific problems resulting from lifted short arms without introducing the fairly specific problems of your typical long arm kit. As you describe, we do not know this yet.

 

[Rickyd]

yes, that was this pic's alignment, couldn't see the arm on the other side, but marked where to put it on the other side.

I see it now. The upper arm is round?

 

[jjvw]

Alignment: Once I had my new wheel base measurement, 99 inches, I found the center point (49-1/2") on my frame. Greg's instructions were to point each control arm to that point. I used a Harbor Freight level that you could lock (not auto level) magnetized to a jack stand. LIned up the bolts to point directly at as close to the same spot as I could get on the frame.

View attachment 631265

View attachment 631266

I will add that locating the instant center at the middle of the frame is very close to what most bolt on long arms create. This will result in the sinking rear and light front during steep climbs that long arms are famous for. Your's just has arms that are shorter than a long arm and longer than a short arm.

 

[Irun]

From the pictures it looks like you're running a bunch of bump-stop up front. Is that due to the small springs? Also, curious if you removed the springs and took the rear to full bump? Asking because I'm wondering how much separation there is between the frame and rear control arm at full bump? I imagine it's okay, just wondering how close it is.

 

[inkedrose]

Your's just has arms that are shorter than a long arm and longer than a short arm.

whats the difference between that and a mid arm? With a mid arm does it help solve some of the anti squat?

 

[jjvw]

whats the difference between that and a mid arm? With a mid arm does it help solve some of the anti squat?

The geometry created by the mounting points is everything. Arm length is a byproduct of the mounting points.

 

[inkedrose]

The geometry created by the mounting points is everything. Arm length is a byproduct of the mounting points.

That makes sense

 

[Rickstar321]

From the pictures it looks like you're running a bunch of bump-stop up front. Is that due to the small springs? Also, curious if you removed the springs and took the rear to full bump? Asking because I'm wondering how much separation there is between the frame and rear control arm at full bump? I imagine it's okay, just wondering how close it is.

Yeah, I'm trying to keep it to the 2-1/2" lift (LCG), and all of my steering components are above the knuckle which puts it kissing the frame at full bump. I'm even considering notching the frame on the passenger side for a little more room for my drag link to come up.

 

[Rickstar321]

I see it now. The upper arm is round?

Yup, literally stock JL/JT control arms.

I see it now. The upper arm is round?

 

[D's Jeep Wrld]

This is very tempting to do since I always see Jl/Jt stuff all over Facebook market place!
Love the writeup on this!

 

[jjvw]

This is very tempting to do since I always see Jl/Jt stuff all over Facebook market place!
Love the writeup on this!

Why?

 

[astjp2]

Why?

I would like to know if i could make the gladiator arms the correct length that my single adjustable ones are? Individually make a fixed arm for each corner. That is where I think it would be best. Once you have the formula it should be easy

 

[jjvw]

I would like to know if i could make the gladiator arms the correct length that my single adjustable ones are? Individually make a fixed arm for each corner. That is where I think it would be best. Once you have the formula it should be easy

I could do that right now to replace the arms on my existing Savvy midarm where the suspension geometry is very good and the arms are adjusted to my specific setup. That takes us right back to a different version of why. But I have no objection to Johnny Joints.